The Principle Of The Tithe: Law & Grace

[LaCumba]

The debate about tithing will continue until the Body of Christ as a whole stops trying to live under two covenants. What gets me the most is that the "LAW" was never meant for the Gentiles, only for the Jews. Religion came along and included the Gentiles. Tithing and/or Giving, whatever you want to call it; the motive behind it should be love. If it is not, you may as well keep your money in your pockets because it profits you nothing. Those who tithe/give out of love, usually see great rewards. Those who tithe/give grudgingly, are usually often wondering when is my breakthrough coming. It's the motive behind your giving. You guys have great knowledge of the Word, but i sense a lot of animosity among you and that shouldn't be. We can all agree to disagree but if you don't understand your brethen's point of view, the correct response would be for you to ask the Holy Spirit for more wisdom and revelation knowledge on the subject. He's waiting on you to ask. We all know what we have read and what we have studied, but remember, the Word of God is not written to your head, it's written to your heart. Peace.

 

[Tony]

The debate about tithing will continue until the Body of Christ as a whole stops trying to live under two covenants. What gets me the most is that the "LAW" was never meant for the Gentiles, only for the Jews. Religion came along and included the Gentiles. Tithing and/or Giving, whatever you want to call it; the motive behind it should be love. If it is not, you may as well keep your money in your pockets because it profits you nothing. Those who tithe/give out of love, usually see great rewards. Those who tithe/give grudgingly, are usually often wondering when is my breakthrough coming. It's the motive behind your giving. You guys have great knowledge of the Word, but i sense a lot of animosity among you and that shouldn't be. We can all agree to disagree but if you don't understand your brethen's point of view, the correct response would be for you to ask the Holy Spirit for more wisdom and revelation knowledge on the subject. He's waiting on you to ask. We all know what we have read and what we have studied, but remember, the Word of God is not written to your head, it's written to your heart. Peace.

This is a good post.
This tithing doctrine has done so much damage to our communities

There are many threads on this site about it.

Every so often somebody will post here or Small Talk feeling good about themselves
saying they pay tithes.

Then someone will show Biblically that, that is neither required or possible
for todays church

Bible Verses get exchanged, old beliefs are held on to firmly and no mention of any other
Old Testament Laws.

I agree with you let's wait until God returns and find out, because
everytime someones mentions "tithing" there will always be a voice
explaining how that is unsound doctrine for todays church.

I wonder how so-call tithers justify eating pork, going to church on Sunday
not gouging thier eye out when they look on someone with lust etc etc

good day

 

[dacontinent]

...I wonder how so-call tithers justify eating pork, going to church on Sunday
not gouging thier eye out when they look on someone with lust etc etc

good day

We've covered those a bunch of times.

 

[Tony]

We've covered those a bunch of times.

just change the subject cause most people don't read the Bible
that's why it becomes easy for modern day preachers to twist it for their selfish gain
first you'll try to make people believe we're commanded to pay
some form of tithe
Then you'll have people going to concerts with
Maze featuring the Spirtual Sons of Eddie Long
Please

Tell the Levite you're paying "tithe" to I said What's up.

 

[illinijag]

What I have discovered in Churches and online that many who support it have never studied it. They just follow the traditional slogans and they have no Biblical defense for their support. After seeing they have no real support, most conclude that it is their desire to do it and that is that. I never met a preacher who could defend it, most in the end stated that they had to do it, or people would not give anything. I counter this statement by saying, maybe they don't give because they have not the heart to give....maybe they are not saved...maybe they don't know "Judgement, Mercy, and Faith". Many think this is their ticket to heaven, not knowing that we are not saved by works.

Tithing is a stronghold which exposes more a lack of faith in that God will really provide. Then again, God provisions may not satisfy man's greed...the people in the desert were given manna ....God's provisions and despised it..

Numbers 11:4-6. And the mixt multitude that was among them fell a lusting: and the children of Israel also wept again, and said, Who shall give us flesh to eat? We remember the fish, which we did eat in Egypt freely; the cucumbers, and the melons, and the leeks, and the onions, and the garlick: But now our soul is dried away: there is nothing at all, beside this manna, before our eyes.

Such has not changed

Good Day and God Bless

 

[Tony]

I mean you can Give them Scripture after Scripture


Luke 16:16
The law and the prophets were until John since that time the kingdom of heaven is preached.

Romans 6:14
For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Romans 7:4 & 6

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.



Romans 10:4
Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.


2 Corinthians 3:14
But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same veil untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which veil is done away in Christ.


Galatians 3:13
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law,
being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Galatians 3:24-25
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.


Galatians 5:18
But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.


Ephesians 2:15
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances.
for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;


Colossians 2:14
Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us,
which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;.


BUT

they are so brainwashed, that
all the while you're trying to show them the Word.


They remain caught up in some kinda daze like

 

[Tiger1]

I mean you can Give them Scripture after Scripture


Luke 16:16
The law and the prophets were until John since that time the kingdom of heaven is preached.

Romans 6:14
Ye are not under the law, but under grace.

Romans 7:4 & 6
Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.




Romans 10:4
Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.


2 Corinthians 3:14
But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same veil untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which veil is done away in Christ.


Galatians 3:13
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law,
being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Galatians 3:24-25
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.


Galatians 5:18
But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.


Ephesians 2:15
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances.
for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;


Colossians 2:14
Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us,
which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;.


BUT

they are so brainwashed, that
all the while you're trying to show them the Word.


The remain caught up in some kinda daze like

Funny!!! :lol:

One of my favorite movie scenes.

BTW, No Drama!!!

IMHO it seems to be two different point of views.

--

The New Covenant did not do away with the tithe but it clarified what the motives for tithing should be.

God wants us to give, "not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver." The type of giving that God loves is cheerful, freewill giving. This does not mean that tithing is contrary to the New Testament. It is the "fear of punishment" motive, that the Old Testament law attached to tithing, that has been done away with. Giving and tithing are still very much a part of the New Testament doctrine, and if done with the New Testament attitude, are still acceptable to God. Be a giver.

Be Blessed!!!

 

[Tony]

Funny!!! :lol:

One of my favorite movie scenes.

BTW, No Drama!!!

IMHO it seems to be two different point of views.

--

The New Covenant did not do away with the tithe but it clarified what the motives for tithing should be.

God wants us to give, "not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver." The type of giving that God loves is cheerful, freewill giving. This does not mean that tithing is contrary to the New Testament. It is the "fear of punishment" motive, that the Old Testament law attached to tithing, that has been done away with. Giving and tithing are still very much a part of the New Testament doctrine, and if done with the New Testament attitude, are still acceptable to God. Be a giver.

Be Blessed!!!

I'm trying to be done with this

Dude you don't even know any Levites...lol...

 

[Tiger1]

I'm trying to be done with this

Dude you don't even know any Levites...lol...

O.k.

Cool.

Thanks!!!

 

[Tony]

The New Covenant did not do away with the tithe but it clarified what the motives for tithing should be.

This is your opinion.

God wants us to give, "not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver." The type of giving that God loves is cheerful, freewill giving. This does not mean that tithing is contrary to the New Testament. It is the "fear of punishment" motive, that the Old Testament law attached to tithing, that has been done away with. Giving and tithing are still very much a part of the New Testament doctrine, and if done with the New Testament attitude, are still acceptable to God. Be a giver.

Be Blessed!!!

I see now you're typing the word "giver" that's what mine says.
Does your say "tither" in that scripture??

 

[Tony]

ok buddy since you got me on this,

most people today seem just like the People of Old

so worried about tithe that you forget about the other Laws

so even if you were tithing you Still wasn't hitting on nothing because you forgot the other laws

Matt 23:23 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
For you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin,
and have neglected the weightier matters of the
law: justice and mercy and faith. These you ought
to have done, without leaving the others undone.


Now read this

Galatians4:4

But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

4:5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

"redeem them that were under the law" ???

does redeem mean save?
why would I need saving if I'm under the law?

was giving to the Levitical priesthood a law?
where are the modern day desecendents of the tribe of Levi?

Oh well we continue to study.

 

[illinijag]

Funny!!! :lol:

One of my favorite movie scenes.

BTW, No Drama!!!

IMHO it seems to be two different point of views.

--

The New Covenant did not do away with the tithe but it clarified what the motives for tithing should be.

God wants us to give, "not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver." The type of giving that God loves is cheerful, freewill giving. This does not mean that tithing is contrary to the New Testament. It is the "fear of punishment" motive, that the Old Testament law attached to tithing, that has been done away with. Giving and tithing are still very much a part of the New Testament doctrine, and if done with the New Testament attitude, are still acceptable to God. Be a giver.

Be Blessed!!!

Come on, Christ has freed you from the bondage of the Law. Let the chains go. You can do it....

Now you are led by the spirit within.. Give freely

2 Corinthians 9:7. Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.

If you continue to reject Truth, the truth will cease to come to you and that which is truth that you have obtained may be taken away.

Mark 4:23-25 (KJV). If any man have ears to hear, let him hear. And he said unto them, Take heed what ye hear: with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you: and unto you that hear shall more be given. For he that hath, to him shall be given: and he that hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he hath.

Mark 4:23-25 (Living Bible). If you have ears, listen! And be sure to put into practice what you hear. The more you do this, the more you will understand what I tell you. To him who has shall be given; from him who has not shall be taken away even what he has.

Tiger1: It is no coincidence that you are getting this message on Tithing, don’t consider is lightly; for what you do with what you hear, matters the most.

Good Day and God Bless

 

[SUtrp96]

Just imagine all the poor people that went without lights, clothes and food because of their misunderstanding of "tithing"... those preachers will have alot to answer for...

 

[Tony]

Just imagine all the poor people that went without lights, clothes and food because of their misunderstanding of "tithing"... those preachers will have alot to answer for...

it's gonna be rough.

"whatever you've done to the least of these....."

 

[dacontinent]

Just imagine all the poor people that went without lights, clothes and food because of their misunderstanding of "tithing"... those preachers will have alot to answer for...

Just thing about all of the poor people who go without lights, clothes, and food because of ours and their misunderstanding of tithing. Those believers who have failed to give cheerfully to ensure that there was enough in the storehouse to prevent those things from happening will have a lot to answer for.

 

[Tony]

Just thing about all of the poor people who go without lights, clothes, and food because of ours and their misunderstanding of tithing. Those believers who have failed to give cheerfully to ensure that there was enough in the storehouse to prevent those things from happening will have a lot to answer for.

you even messed this post up. "giving cheerfully" are the words used in the New Testament
talking about the physical store house that was connected to the temple is Old testament
the Mosaic law commanded you to bring things to that storehouse.

Boy oh boy :shame:

 

[LaCumba]

Just imagine all the poor people that went without lights, clothes and food because of their misunderstanding of "tithing"... those preachers will have alot to answer for...

I disagree with that. Those same people had a responsibility to themselves to read, study and meditate on the word so that they could get their own revelation knowledge and not rely on the minister to do all of the work. I guarantee you that if they didn't rely so much on the minister's knowledge (or lack thereof), they would not be suckered in to a lot of the foolishness that goes on today. There is a place for giving, sewing seeds, sacrificial seeds, etc., but like i stated earlier, the motive behind your giving is more important.

 

[Tiger1]

Tiger1: It is no coincidence that you are getting this message on Tithing, don’t consider is lightly; for what you do with what you hear, matters the most.

Good Day and God Bless

O.k.

Thanks

Right back at you doc!!! :whatever:

Be Blessed!!!

 

[dacontinent]

you even messed this post up. "giving cheerfully" are the words used in the New Testament
talking about the physical store house that was connected to the temple is Old testament
the Mosaic law commanded you to bring things to that storehouse.

Boy oh boy :shame:

Nope. I didn't mess it up. It was the impetus for establishing deacons: to preserve equity in the distribution to the widows and the poor in Acts 6.

Remember...? Many people in the early church GAVE EVERYTHING THEY HAD and people had ALL THINGS IN COMMON...wa-a-a-a-a-ay past the principle of tithing.

I don't know what anyone else reading this thread gives. That is not any of my business; and that is between those persons and God. So, when I say this, I am in no way trying to indict, accuse, etc. anyone on this board.

It is my own experience with people that I encounter face-to-face that the vast majority of people who oppose the concept of the tithe have never given as much as 10% of their income for a period of even 6 months in their entire lives. The most common reasoning: that's too much money to give. The conclusion being that they have no heart or willingness to ever do so. The #2 view is that "things are tight right now, but when my ship comes in ..." Well, what usually happens is that either the ship never arrives or they still look at the same currency denomenations that they looked at before the ship arrived.

These are often the same people who will

• turn down positions in a company because of the lack of benefits and then refuse to approve insurance coverage for church staffers;
• won't give to a benevolence fund and then complain when they are in need and there is nothing in the fund to assist them;
• won't serve on even a short-term missions effort and will not contribute so others can go because they don't trust how the money will be spent;
• and on an on.

These are stingy and greedy people with no vision for the Kingdom of God and their role in seeing its fruition through their giving.

Do we really think that the widow who gave two mite went needy after Jesus watched her give her reserve? If so, then we should be ashamed of ourselves.

 

[dacontinent]

I disagree with that. Those same people had a responsibility to themselves to read, study and meditate on the word so that they could get their own revelation knowledge and not rely on the minister to do all of the work. I guarantee you that if they didn't rely so much on the minister's knowledge (or lack thereof), they would not be suckered in to a lot of the foolishness that goes on today. There is a place for giving, sewing seeds, sacrificial seeds, etc., but like i stated earlier, the motive behind your giving is more important.

:clap::clap::clap::clap:

Furthermore, giving is primarily purposeful and not impulsive. I cannot tell you the number of times that I have seen the offertory frenzy ... where people who did not come prepared to give get caught up in "the blessing of the moment" and borrow money from other people for offertory. The lenders, because of their generosity, start doling out money to these people again and again, resulting in their own dissolution about giving. The borowwers rarely ever make restitution and never learn to give purposefully; to sacrifice on other things just in order to give because we want to be a channel of blessing.

There are times when an unforeseen opportunity will be presented to us and God will gives us a genuine compassion to give to the situation without us having previously set aside provision for it (primarily almsgiving). By all means we should follow the leading of the Spirit and give as He directs us. At the same time, we must learn from the principles of the OT with the tithing, the offerings, and the feasts that worship ALWAYS includes sacrifice and we have to prepare that sacrifice before we can give it. Hence, giving is a nurtured part of our lifestyle.

We can give without loving, but we cannot love without giving.

 

[JayRob]

Tithing is simply a madeup law by men just like religion is. No one has to give ten percent of anything in order to get something back. One can give to any worthy cause as he/she is able or chooses.

This tithing fiasco has caused a lot of folks to go into debt, when they could've used that money to pay off their bills.

 

[dacontinent]

Tithing is simply a madeup law by men just like religion is. No one has to give ten percent of anything in order to get something back. One can give to any worthy cause as he/she is able or chooses.

This tithing fiasco has caused a lot of folks to go into debt, when they could've used that money to pay off their bills.

Tithing has also been a schoolmaster teaching many people to be givers and to walk out of out of debt into positions of fiscal strength...while thoroughly enjoying the process. :lol:

 

[SUtrp96]

I disagree with that. Those same people had a responsibility to themselves to read, study and meditate on the word so that they could get their own revelation knowledge and not rely on the minister to do all of the work. I guarantee you that if they didn't rely so much on the minister's knowledge (or lack thereof), they would not be suckered in to a lot of the foolishness that goes on today. There is a place for giving, sewing seeds, sacrificial seeds, etc., but like i stated earlier, the motive behind your giving is more important.

I totally agree with you on that. But I do see what some of these Pastors are doing as preying on the weak.

 

[SUtrp96]

You know what's sad.

Our black families have drug addict realtives, poor relatives that obviously needs help instead of constant critisism. But these folk give to the church and leave their family members hanging and just talk about them like dogs...

My spirit just don't sit right with that....They will defend these money hungry church leaders and leave their family hanging...

Now I speak on this because I see it in my family.



:tup:

 

[dacontinent]

Thanks for helping to take care of your family. The financial concerns are many and varied. I have been/am in similar situations. I will encourage you to invest far more into them spiritually than you do financially. That is where you will help the most and quickest.