Signing Day Misses - Are HBCUs Hurting Ourselves


F

FAMU CLIFF

New Member
Not a direct criticism of the players any school signed, but are we missing the boat to some degree? Many have noted that HBCU recruiting may be limited in that our schools only go after a segment of the pool of quality FCS talent. That would be the exclusion of white players (to varying degrees depending on program). But in looking at the signing day lists, we appear to be ignoring the Northern Black football player. I know the large FAMU class is over 90% FL high school talent, which I love due to the talent pool there and the decreased cost of in state scholarships. But from the standpoint of limiting our reach and getting the ALL the best potential players, I think there may be something missing. There are plenty of players who play at quality FCS programs or even lower tier FBS schools (think the MAC) who we may be able to pull.

What are your thoughts?
 
Cliff,

Here is my view. If you sign 19 recruits yet only 6 come from the state in which the University resides in, what does that say about the University. I am a very Firm believer that if a kid is good enough to play on a playoff-calibur football and even a state-championship football team, they are good enough to play in the SWAC. Not every kid that plays in a State Championship Game is being recruited by FBS Schools. Those "Dandy Dozens" as we call them in Mississippi are NOT the only ones playing for their respective teams.

Another problem is LAZINESS. Wanting to win with Talent only instead of taking the back-breaking steps necessary to coach them up.
 
Last edited:



FAMU CLIFF said:
Not a direct criticism of the players any school signed, but are we missing the boat to some degree? Many have noted that HBCU recruiting may be limited in that our schools only go after a segment of the pool of quality FCS talent. That would be the exclusion of white players (to varying degrees depending on program). But in looking at the signing day lists, we appear to be ignoring the Northern Black football player. I know the large FAMU class is over 90% FL high school talent, which I love due to the talent pool there and the decreased cost of in state scholarships. But from the standpoint of limiting our reach and getting the ALL the best potential players, I think there may be something missing. There are plenty of players who play at quality FCS programs or even lower tier FBS schools (think the MAC) who we may be able to pull.

What are your thoughts?
Click to expand...

This has already been established, as far as us having white players JSU got talked about for 2 years for having a white qb ...so with that said our schools remain to think and our stuck in the past accept certain programs but thats not saying much either...and for over 6 years we have always recruited players from the Michigan area so I think its a matter of coaches network...
 
mighty hornet said:
Cliff,
Do you think we have the recruiting budgets to do heavy recruiting in the North?
Click to expand...

No I do not and have thought about how to accomplish that. Things like coaching clinics and 7 on 7 camps where we send invites to inner city programs up North. Put your coaches on a bus tour to markets up North where you have alumni associations to fundraise and invite athletic and academic talent to meet your staffs in various sports. Primary goal may be fundraising with alumni and corporations but use it for another purpose as well. Do you know much recruiting the Alabama HBCUs are doing in St. Louis. How much extra does it cost to send a member of the football staff to visit with a few local coaches and beat writers? The HBCU conferences doing outreach by inviting sports writers at Black newspapers to cover our major tournaments and classics. A guy like Earl Austin Jr. covers high school sports for the St. Louis American and knows ALL the local players and coaches in bball.




http://www.earlaustinjr.com/
 
FAMU CLIFF said:
No I do not and have thought about how to accomplish that. Things like coaching clinics and 7 on 7 camps where we send invites to inner city programs up North. Put your coaches on a bus tour to markets up North where you have alumni associations to fundraise and invite athletic and academic talent to meet your staffs in various sports. Primary goal may be fundraising with alumni and corporations but use it for another purpose as well. Do you know much recruiting the Alabama HBCUs are doing in St. Louis. How much extra does it cost to send a member of the football staff to visit with a few local coaches and beat writers? The HBCU conferences doing outreach by inviting sports writers at Black newspapers to cover our major tournaments and classics. A guy like Earl Austin Jr. covers high school sports for the St. Louis American and knows ALL the local players and coaches in bball.




http://www.earlaustinjr.com/
Click to expand...

Its not that hard we just make excuses for it not to be done.....
 
jag4life said:
Recruiting budgets may not allow for many schools to travel north for recruits.
Click to expand...

That is why we have to be creative. In your case, Aneas Williams has stayed in the local St. Louis community and does A LOT of community stuff. Man is he respected. Send one of your coaches up here and let Aneas take him around for a few days. Instant credibility. You also had Mike Jones on staff prior who is a local hero for the Super Bowl tackle and also had a successful short stint as coach of Hazelwood East, a noted local program. I worked with a former GSU baseball player whose son is either playing there now or on the way next year. One of my best friends is married to a former SU player who has over 50 youth players on various teams in his program and is sponsored by Cardinals Care.

Man, I agree we dont have the money for pure standard recruiting that is done today, but the stuff HBCUs USED to do all the time, can be done today. We have human capital and relationships we can leverage.
 
JSUDMJ2004 said:
This has already been established, as far as us having white players JSU got talked about for 2 years for having a white qb ...so with that said our schools remain to think and our stuck in the past accept certain programs but thats not saying much either...and for over 6 years we have always recruited players from the Michigan area so I think its a matter of coaches network...
Click to expand...

I know different programs take different approaches on it. That is why I qualified my statement, but it seems it ALWAYS comes up when we discuss our athletic deficiencies and even some of our coaches have said it in the press. Heck Billy Joe said it when he was going to and winning in the playoffs.
 
FAMU CLIFF said:
That is why we have to be creative. In your case, Aneas Williams has stayed in the local St. Louis community and does A LOT of community stuff. Man is he respected. Send one of your coaches up here and let Aneas take him around for a few days. Instant credibility. You also had Mike Jones on staff prior who is a local hero for the Super Bowl tackle and also had a successful short stint as coach of Hazelwood East, a noted local program. I worked with a former GSU baseball player whose son is either playing there now or on the way next year. One of my best friends is married to a former SU player who has over 50 youth players on various teams in his program and is sponsored by Cardinals Care.

Man, I agree we dont have the money for pure standard recruiting that is done today, but the stuff HBCUs USED to do all the time, can be done today. We have human capital and relationships we can leverage.
Click to expand...

So you're moreso talking about the midwest. SU used to get players from Ohio all the time when Pete was coaching... partly because he's from there and paid particular attention to the area. This season SU picked up a number of Florida kids, especially Miami... our Receivers coach is from Miami.
 
jag4life said:
So you're moreso talking about the midwest. SU used to get players from Ohio all the time when Pete was coaching... partly because he's from there and paid particular attention to the area. This season SU picked up a number of Florida kids, especially Miami... our Receivers coach is from Miami.
Click to expand...

I could only speak directly to stuff I know about in St. Louis. I am sure our schools have those kinds of relationships all over. SU and GSU should dominate Cali. And by the way, Stump Mitchell MAY be on the Ring of Honor in the dome the Rams play in. Coaches would remember him from his Rams days. He and Aneas show up at schools, people are going to listen.
 
BRAVEHEART123 said:
Cliff,

Here is my view. If you sign 19 recruits yet only 6 come from the state in which the University resides in, what does that say about the University. I am a very Firm believer that if a kid is good enough to play on a playoff-calibur football and even a state-championship football team, they are good enough to play in the SWAC. Not every kid that plays in a State Championship Game is being recruited by FBS Schools. Those "Dandy Dozens" as we call them in Mississippi are the only ones playing for their respective teams.

Another problem is LAZINESS. Wanting to win with Talent only instead of taking the back-breaking steps necessary to coach them up.
Click to expand...

Brah, you really need to stop cause u sounding like on ignorant mo phucka..It doesn't matter where it comes from you expound your base and get the best players...Who's to say those co so aches did not recruit students from around MS....maybe those that they were after wasn't gonna qualify..Why put all your eggs in one basket....The coaches went after the QB and WR from Vburg and they signed with MS juco.....stop trynna blast folk when u know absolutely nothing brah..maybe u need counseling cause u got major isuues.....
 
Most coaches like to see a prospect in person before signing. You can don that with in state kids, not so much with those from out of state. Recruiting off of video is tricky, those highlight films are designed to disguise flaws.
 
FAMU CLIFF said:
I could only speak directly to stuff I know about in St. Louis. I am sure our schools have those kinds of relationships all over. SU and GSU should dominate Cali. And by the way, Stump Mitchell MAY be on the Ring of Honor in the dome the Rams play in. Coaches would remember him from his Rams days. He and Aneas show up at schools, people are going to listen.
Click to expand...

You made a good point...Sometimes its up to the alumni bases to help those coaches offset expenses when recruiting from home......If coaches see an athlete they want out of state, they should contact the alumni base there to see if they can help the coach by helping offset expenditures to visit the athlete.
 
Some interesting points have been made. I remember when Archie Cooley was quoted about recruiting budgets when Jerry Rice was in college.
 



JSU/99 said:
Most coaches like to see a prospect in person before signing. You can don that with in state kids, not so much with those from out of state. Recruiting off of video is tricky, those highlight films are designed to disguise flaws.
Click to expand...

That is where relationships come it. High school coaches tend not to burn a coach they know over one kid as it kills the relationship. You also use that to get full game films. So you see their players and the opposing players. You also send alumni (former players) you have relationships with to take a look. You also have those kids come down for camps and get a look then. I know coaches hype of EVERY class, but Taylor is claiming his best class at FAMU (and some are agreeing) and Taylor noted in the press it was due to instituting a 7 on 7 camp. Why we didnt have a camp before it totally inexcusable for an FCS program that offers the full scholarship allotment.
 
FAMU CLIFF said:
I could only speak directly to stuff I know about in St. Louis. I am sure our schools have those kinds of relationships all over. SU and GSU should dominate Cali. And by the way, Stump Mitchell MAY be on the Ring of Honor in the dome the Rams play in. Coaches would remember him from his Rams days. He and Aneas show up at schools, people are going to listen.
Click to expand...

I do agree we (SU and GSU) should have more kids from Cali. We used too. Our baseball team gets them. As for Stump. Remember he played for the St. Louis Cardinals which are the Arizona Cardinals so he should be in the Arizona ring of honor. I would like us to get more West Coast players. Last time SU had some we won the SWAC with Wofford and his white OL that played Center for us. Our current starting RB is from Seattle. Budgets keep these coaches from traveling. But if we (HBCUs) didn't pay our Head Coaches so much money maybe we would have a little more money for recruiting. But hey that's just my opinion.
 
EB said:
Some interesting points have been made. I remember when Archie Cooley was quoted about recruiting budgets when Jerry Rice was in college.
Click to expand...

Larry Walls at Sumner high in St. Louis was one of the best ever in Missouri and he was an Eddie Robinson disciple. Coached at GSU for a time and ran that misdirection offense as well for decades. We have a former pro QB on staff as our QB coach. Earl Holmes has ALOT of league contacts and goes and works with Dick LaBeau every summer. ASSUMING SU and FAMU are meeting in the Atlanta Classic, could our coaches do a promotional tour together and visit some cities up North, talk to sports writers and visit schools and alumni chapters in joint events and have the 100 Black Men obtain a sponsor for it? Win Win Win.

Not saying all of this is easy or doable, but with limited resources, I think we can come up with viable out of the box solutions. What works for JSU, may not work for PV or FAMU, but I think there is a talent pool we can all type in methods effective for our given circumstances.
 
JR said:
I do agree we (SU and GSU) should have more kids from Cali. We used too. Our baseball team gets them. As for Stump. Remember he played for the St. Louis Cardinals which are the Arizona Cardinals so he should be in the Arizona ring of honor. I would like us to get more West Coast players. Last time SU had some we won the SWAC with Wofford and his white OL that played Center for us. Our current starting RB is from Seattle. Budgets keep these coaches from traveling. But if we (HBCUs) didn't pay our Head Coaches so much money maybe we would have a little more money for recruiting. But hey that's just my opinion.
Click to expand...

Actually the ring of honor here is guys who played pro ball in St. Louis and LA Rams. so you have old school Cardinals on it.
 
ATLBRAVE said:
You made a good point...Sometimes its up to the alumni bases to help those coaches offset expenses when recruiting from home......If coaches see an athlete they want out of state, they should contact the alumni base there to see if they can help the coach by helping offset expenditures to visit the athlete.
Click to expand...

We already have alumni chapters and Greek orgs (stuffed with our alumni) in every Northern city sending bus tours to HBCUs. Put some athletes on the bus.
 
It's frustrating isn't it CLIFF? You make excellent points about things that could be done to increase the probability of recruiting a guy on the level of a Kellen Moore. And they're out there but I'm not sure if coaching staffs @ HBCUs are mentally equipped for the rigors of establishing solid foundations w/ HS coaches who will NOTE a K-Moore coming through their programme, although allegedly undersized, but has the skills. Also, I think a lot of HBCU coaching staffs are ghetto-chittlin' certified as hell. They seem to lack required intelligence and professional decorum as we find @ HWCUs. The CURRENT PV staff has intelligence and professional decorum. Can't say the same for the priors too much, esp during the pre-Frazier days. :smh: Just dumb as hell and very unprofessional.

One thing that frustrates the HELL out of me is encountering a kid like this @ the HS level: Rex Burkhead. Football officiando and would run CIRCLES around ANY RB ever recruited to the SWAC recently. He played on a predominantly white HS squad (Plano E/W? now @ Univ of Nebraska) but the kid could run and had power AND he was a weightroom-rat. Why a school like Prairie View does NOT notice and contact these types of kids their soph/jr year is beyond me. Now, riddle me, why would you NOT want someone like that on your squad? It's quite a few of those types @ Sam Houston State University and WATCH how they smash Texas Southern University @ their place like a black cockroach. Just watch. :| Disparity in talent and huge disparity in coaching (philosophy). :read:
 
Last edited:
JR said:
I do agree we (SU and GSU) should have more kids from Cali. We used too. Our baseball team gets them. As for Stump. Remember he played for the St. Louis Cardinals which are the Arizona Cardinals so he should be in the Arizona ring of honor. I would like us to get more West Coast players. Last time SU had some we won the SWAC with Wofford and his white OL that played Center for us. Our current starting RB is from Seattle. Budgets keep these coaches from traveling. But if we (HBCUs) didn't pay our Head Coaches so much money maybe we would have a little more money for recruiting. But hey that's just my opinion.
Click to expand...

Heck Stump spent his own money on travel many times anyway, so it evened out.
 
Panth,

Burkhead wouldn't have come to PV... he had offers from every big time BCS school with a running game. Sometimes you have to focus your attention realistically.
 
jag4life said:
Panth,

Burkhead wouldn't have come to PV... he had offers from every big time BCS school with a running game. Sometimes you have to focus your attention realistically.
Click to expand...

We will never know what's "realistic" because PV never tried. :confused:

Thanks for answering your own assertion. :tup: Although it is my understanding that staff did speak w/ Mr Andrew Luck when he was @ St Pius (?). :swink: lol

P88 wrote> "contacting their 10th grade and/or 11th grade year (as they're up and coming?" THAT is what I have a problem w/. A simple letter of "continue to do well and we got our good eye on ya'." I don't understand the defeatist mentality quite a few of you black people have. lol :emlaugh: :lol:
 
Panther88 said:
We will never know what's "realistic" because PV never tried. :confused:

Thanks for answering your own assertion. :tup: Although it is my understanding that staff did speak w/ Mr Andrew Luck when he was @ St Pius (?). :swink: lol

P88 wrote> "contacting their 10th grade and/or 11th grade year (as they're up and coming?" THAT is what I have a problem w/. A simple letter of "continue to do well and we got our good eye on ya'." I don't understand the defeatist mentality quite a few of you black people have. lol :emlaugh: :lol:
Click to expand...

Luck went to Stratford.

I feel you on sending a letter of some sort. Maybe as Alums we can start volunteering to write and send letters to these guys in their early years.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top