Thanks for pointing that out.
Was Tony Dungy Wrong?
- Thread starter The Founder
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Thanks for pointing that out.
What wrong with supporting the Rangers? They're outchea preventing forest fires and fending off the bears from stealing picnic baskets.
CEE DOG
Well-Known Member
The difference is Dungy gets paid to speak on this stuff. We don't. We don't even get paid to be on TSPN and can all get fired for it. With that being said, gays need to go sit down some where.
GRAM4LIFE
Well-Known Member
He gets paid to speak on football. If he isn't smart enough to realize that there are topics he shouldn't speak because he isn't on a message board speaking anonymously like you, he will caught in a media circus like he is now. It is easy to AMEN what he said when it has no impact on you hence my comment about you speaking at your own job about it. He should have been as political astute as possible when asked any question about this subject. You cannot win.
JR
Well-Known Member
The Founder
Well-Known Member
Some interesting comments.
Tony Dungy in my opinon is a great man, but in this case he was wrong. In Tony's first book he spoke about how much it hurt for his son to commit suicide. In the Bible it clearly states the punishment for suicide. In having empathy how would Tony feel if some in the religous community stated where he son would go for such a crime against God?
In this case Tony Dungy should have never stated that he would not take him, but solely stated that the young man would face problems and reach out to him. Then state to Michael personally and privately how he felt. The media nor NBC could not do a thing or for that matter have any comment.
Tony has a right to say what he wants, but that comes with a price.
Tony Dungy in my opinon is a great man, but in this case he was wrong. In Tony's first book he spoke about how much it hurt for his son to commit suicide. In the Bible it clearly states the punishment for suicide. In having empathy how would Tony feel if some in the religous community stated where he son would go for such a crime against God?
In this case Tony Dungy should have never stated that he would not take him, but solely stated that the young man would face problems and reach out to him. Then state to Michael personally and privately how he felt. The media nor NBC could not do a thing or for that matter have any comment.
Tony has a right to say what he wants, but that comes with a price.
I don't think Tony Dungy knew it would be included in the article. The article was about Derrick Brooks. During a break, the reporter asked his opinion and noted it in the article. He didn't ask a follow-up question until after the firestorm. According to the reporter, the tape recorder was still rolling during this "break." This was according to the reporter who was on Mike and Mike this morning. So, I really don't think this was meant to be some grand statment or assertion about the Sams issue.
major095
ASU4real
He was asked his opinion. He gave it. He doesn't have to be cowed. The article doesn't go into his why on the matter and to assume or speculate is to do just that... speculate. Speculate away as I will now and interject my own thoughts on the matter. Vick had done something wrong and paid the price and had a much higher potential as a football player than Sam. Tebow proved himself a winner, if not a qb, and there are many teams in need of a winner. Sam hasn't done anything wrong per say. Attention seeking for sure. Trying to capitalize off of being the first openly gay player, certainly. That will create a media circus and make it difficult for the rams to cut him if in fact he is not good enough.
My only question is one I've asked but no one has yet to give a real answer to and if one of you can then I'll be grateful. Very practical matter. When I go to the gym the men and women have separate locker rooms. I believe that to be because of the gender difference and what that gender difference means. If men were to get dressed/undressed/shower with women what would happen? Would the men look at the women? Yes, I believe they would. Many would even say ogle. Now why would they do that? Because, imo, most men are attracted to women. Would they still look at those women if their job or their marriage would be on the line? I believe most still would. In fact I don't know many men who could resist looking at a naked woman if she was standing anywhere in the line of sight. I believe that to not be the right thing to do, but I don't believe most men could resist. Now Sam is no women. He is in fact a pretty big man.... that likes to look at other men. Do I think that in a room full of physically fit men, Sam will be able to resist looking at them? I do not. I don't believe that he as a gay man, can stand next to a naked man and not look. At Alcorn, sad as it was, the men's tower only had locker room style showers. Big open room with shower heads on the walls and no stalls. The lights were regularly kept off because no one wanted to see anyone else. But had women been showering there as well... you know. More on that .
So my very practical question is do the guys on the rams have a right not to be eyeballed by a gay teammate while in the locker room? To simply say he's at work and wouldn't do that is to ignore the truth of how people can act when they are sexually attracted to that gender regardless or work or marriage status. If they do have the right not to be exposed to someone else's prying eyes then should there not be a separate locker room or an adjustment to the locker room just as their are for men and women at your local gym? I'm asking and if not please explain to me why not, because I'm not getting it.
On a couple of occasions one of the girls staying overnight would sneak in and take a shower and boy, the whole dorm, and campus would hear about it, because whoever was in the shower when she got in looked and looked some more.
My only question is one I've asked but no one has yet to give a real answer to and if one of you can then I'll be grateful. Very practical matter. When I go to the gym the men and women have separate locker rooms. I believe that to be because of the gender difference and what that gender difference means. If men were to get dressed/undressed/shower with women what would happen? Would the men look at the women? Yes, I believe they would. Many would even say ogle. Now why would they do that? Because, imo, most men are attracted to women. Would they still look at those women if their job or their marriage would be on the line? I believe most still would. In fact I don't know many men who could resist looking at a naked woman if she was standing anywhere in the line of sight. I believe that to not be the right thing to do, but I don't believe most men could resist. Now Sam is no women. He is in fact a pretty big man.... that likes to look at other men. Do I think that in a room full of physically fit men, Sam will be able to resist looking at them? I do not. I don't believe that he as a gay man, can stand next to a naked man and not look. At Alcorn, sad as it was, the men's tower only had locker room style showers. Big open room with shower heads on the walls and no stalls. The lights were regularly kept off because no one wanted to see anyone else. But had women been showering there as well... you know. More on that .
So my very practical question is do the guys on the rams have a right not to be eyeballed by a gay teammate while in the locker room? To simply say he's at work and wouldn't do that is to ignore the truth of how people can act when they are sexually attracted to that gender regardless or work or marriage status. If they do have the right not to be exposed to someone else's prying eyes then should there not be a separate locker room or an adjustment to the locker room just as their are for men and women at your local gym? I'm asking and if not please explain to me why not, because I'm not getting it.
On a couple of occasions one of the girls staying overnight would sneak in and take a shower and boy, the whole dorm, and campus would hear about it, because whoever was in the shower when she got in looked and looked some more.
The Founder
Well-Known Member
This is the reason that in my opinion a person should not express their sexual orientation. Let's be honest here. It's not the men like Michael Sam that concerns men in the locker rooms. It's the men who are "flaming" for choice of better words that concerns men in the locker. Also, this issue can be flipped back on straight men that if you are sure of your sexual orientation then being anywhere with a gay man should not concern you.
Michael Sam is not the only gay man in the NFL....the others just don't say anything because they know it would disrupt the bond they have with other men.
Also, since this would be an issue, the NFL should construct locker rooms where the showers and dressing areas provide more privacy.
Let's ostracize gay players even more.
The Founder
Well-Known Member
Actually it's not a silly question but a question of reality. Women face this issue with men therefore there are separate bathrooms. If a straight man does not want to be nude in front of a gay man then it's their right. The NFL should take precautions to make the hetorsexual community comfortable. Create a more private shower and dressing.
dacontinent
Preacher
The articles says
"I wouldn't have taken him," Dungy told Ira Kaufman of The Tampa Tribune. "Not because I don't believe Michael Sam should have a chance to play, but I wouldn't want to deal with all of it. It's not going to be totally smooth…things will happen."
So, Tony Dungy believes Michael Sam should have a chance to play. If Dungy was in the organization considering Sam in the draft, his opinion would be to not take Sam because Dungy would not want to deal with the consequences that would go along with it.
I like Maybach automobiles. They are EXTREMELY nice. However, I don't want to deal with all of the stuff that comes along with ownership. So, I would NEVER choose to own one.
"I wouldn't have taken him," Dungy told Ira Kaufman of The Tampa Tribune. "Not because I don't believe Michael Sam should have a chance to play, but I wouldn't want to deal with all of it. It's not going to be totally smooth…things will happen."
So, Tony Dungy believes Michael Sam should have a chance to play. If Dungy was in the organization considering Sam in the draft, his opinion would be to not take Sam because Dungy would not want to deal with the consequences that would go along with it.
I like Maybach automobiles. They are EXTREMELY nice. However, I don't want to deal with all of the stuff that comes along with ownership. So, I would NEVER choose to own one.
The Founder
Well-Known Member
No...just create a shower area like they have in the public gyms that people join. See you are focused on the ostracization rather the term privacy.
97JSULEGEND
Well-Known Member
If being **Y does not say your like having relations with the same gender then what else is it. It's telling the world you like to have relations period. it's not a skin color, disease,or sickness right? So what other rights should you have for your bedroom activities...SMH
The Founder
Well-Known Member
You know it's not that simple with the gay community. It's about equality...but their equality comes with a price. The price is the uncomfortability of others. So instead of creating an entire separate dressing area...just revamp the showers and add a few partitions and provide players with robes. :lol:
So you're comparing men to women. Genius!
The Founder
Well-Known Member
Kendrick it's not....
I know that every gay man is not attracted to all men. Just like every man is not attracted to all women. Yet, in order to make everyone comfortable create a showering and dressing are condusive to everyone.
major095
ASU4real
And you still couldn't/didn't provide a cogent explanation of why my reasoning was wrong.... which is what I asked for. Either you can't or you're unwilling. So why is what I asked silly? Please reference my first post so you don't use one of those arguments that ignores what happens in real life.
Amazing. Just amazing.
You do know the Mizzou football team got through an entire season without having to use separate showers, right?
I don't know how they did it. A miracle I tell ya.
The Founder
Well-Known Member
Kendrick question: Would you join a GYM like Washington Sports Club if they had open showers where you were showing with other men?
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