Was the teacher wrong in this case?


skyvolt2000

skyvolt2000

Well-Known Member
http://dallasisdblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/05/seagoville-high-school-watches.html

Several students and even the classroom teacher stood by and watched as a Seagoville High School student repeatedly punched another student in the face. The attack occurred in the middle of a Dallas ISD geometry classroom, and the video shows that the teacher did not flinch.

The student who was attacked, Michael Milczanowksi, told WFAA that he felt targeted for months.

Should the teacher have intervened?

A 2008 story by Tawnell Hobbs found that assaults by students on Dallas ISD employees and volunteers had more than doubled over a 5-year span from 147 incidents in 2002-03 to 312 in 2006-07, according to district statistics.

Superintendent Michael Hinojosa said in 2008 he didn't think DISD had a policy about how employees should handle fights.

"Sometimes things arise and you just have to create a policy," he said at the time.

The Dallas school district has spent a large amount of money on "assault leave," relief pay mandated by state law for employees seriously injured. DISD spent $1.2 million on assault leave for 42 employees from January 2004 to November 2007, according to a Dallas Morning News analysis.


ANd before any asked where was security-this person has your answer.

allaboutkids
3:21 PM on 5/10/2011

It is very easy to judge. You weren't there and neither was I. I will try very hard to explain there was no point in calling security. If their school is like mine, the "security in the building was shown the door in the middle of the day that all the central office was "fired." There is no security.

Man or woman, most teachers have been told not to interfere until there is blood.
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The teacher should have called for assistance from another teacher. But I do NOT see any wrong in what the teacher did. Chances are good that if the teacher had intervened and hurt one of the students while trying to break up that scuffle, then we would be talking about how the teacher was wrong for getting in the fight.

LOL...all this is a testament to how much discipline is taught in our schools. And we have the nerve to say that our education is world class. Yeah right...give me a break. But I digress.

No...the teacher was NOT wrong for not getting in that scuffle. He should have called for assistance though.
 



The teacher is on leave now.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/Students-Classroom-brawls--121605144.html

After a quick search on YouTube, we found at least half a dozen videos allegedly depicting brawls on the SHS campus, all apparently recorded by students with cell phones.

One showed two boys punching each other in the bathroom.

Another showed girls fighting in the hallway.

In nearly all of the videos, others are seen cheering on the combatants.

The Dallas ISD concedes that fights have been an issue in the past at Seagoville High. The district said it has made safety improvements, but although there's no district-wide policy, administrators actually discourage teachers from physically trying to stop fights.

"Each situation is going to be different," said DISD spokeswoman Paige Collins. "We're promoting that the teacher not get directly in between the punching of students. Now, should an adult know the kids well enough that they can get them separated, that's one thing, but we really want to keep the staff safe as well."

YouTube has now removed most of the fighting videos.

Administrators said the student involved in the most recent fight has been punished, and his teacher has been placed on leave.
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Youtube has removed those videos??? What about the other 5,000 vidoes?
 
PVSAX99 said:
The teacher should have called for assistance from another teacher. But I do NOT see any wrong in what the teacher did. Chances are good that if the teacher had intervened and hurt one of the students while trying to break up that scuffle, then we would be talking about how the teacher was wrong for getting in the fight.

LOL...all this is a testament to how much discipline is taught in our schools. And we have the nerve to say that our education is world class. Yeah right...give me a break. But I digress.

No...the teacher was NOT wrong for not getting in that scuffle. He should have called for assistance though.
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Dude, are you serious? The teacher didn't even try to intervene verbally, much less physically. Whose the leader of that classroom, the teacher or the students?
 
JayRob said:
Dude, are you serious? The teacher didn't even try to intervene verbally, much less physically. Whose the leader of that classroom, the teacher or the students?
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The WFAA article says the teacher was yelling at them to stop.
 
Hey, I dont blame him. After all those lawsuits that the teachers face, being fired from school, etc.... I would have went and sat down, cause my legs would have been hurting just standing there watching.
 
JayRob said:
Dude, are you serious? The teacher didn't even try to intervene verbally, much less physically. Whose the leader of that classroom, the teacher or the students?
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The students and their loud mouth sue happy, "My baby ain't done nothing" so-called parents.

The teacher did exactly what the teacher should have done and that is keeping their hands off those students. I will gurantee you that teacher would have been sued along with the school if a adult laid a hand on them. Then there is the problem of the teacher getting attacked or hurt trying to break up the fight. Teachers these days should call security, keep their hands to themselves, and watch these mofo's tear each others head off. They want to act like thugs, let them.

My brother did that 13 years ago and got kicked in the lower back seperating two ignorant POS from fighting at Hazelhurst Highschool. He ain't walked without a cane OR pain since being wheeled out the school that day on a streacher. The school NOR THE DISTRICT ain't done a damm thing to help him to this day. The kid that did it stayed in school. He was already in the Hazelhust alternative program for bad azz kids anyway. HE GRADUATED TO DEATH ROW at PARCHMAN 4 YEARS AGO AFTER KILLING A CRYSTAL SPRINGS POLICE OFFICER.
 
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Blacknbengal said:
Hey, I dont blame him. After all those lawsuits that the teachers face, being fired from school, etc.... I would have went and sat down, cause my legs would have been hurting just standing there watching.
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EXACTLY!!!
Let these fools kill each other cause if a teacher lay a hand on one of these fools, chances are they will be arrested for assault by the time those bratts finish telling lies about what happened. Don't even thing the schools Administration will back the teacher up either. They too busy trying to keep their azz out the "gonna sue you" sling.

Under the bus the teacher will go. :smh:
 
PVSAX99 said:
What would you have done in that situation?
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I will answer that since I have been trained as a school volunteer.

I would have
  1. Screamed at the assailant to stop;
  2. Instructed a student to make the intercom call for security;
  3. Stepped between the students, facing the assailant, with a chair for protection;
  4. Disabled the assailant if he attempted to further assault me or anyone else.
 
I wouldn't have done anything either...I changed my mind about teaching and I'm so glad I did. These kids & parents today are just too much.
 
Blacknbengal said:
Hey, I dont blame him. After all those lawsuits that the teachers face, being fired from school, etc.... I would have went and sat down, cause my legs would have been hurting just standing there watching.
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jstate83 said:
EXACTLY!!!
Let these fools kill each other cause if a teacher lay a hand on one of these fools, chances are they will be arrested for assault by the time those bratts finish telling lies about what happened. Don't even thing the schools Administration will back the teacher up either. They too busy trying to keep their azz out the "gonna sue you" sling.

Under the bus the teacher will go. :smh:
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That's sound like my uncle when he worked for the school board. "let um beat the hell out each other,then take them to the office".
 
dacontinent said:
I will answer that since I have been trained as a school volunteer.

I would have
  1. Screamed at the assailant to stop;
  2. Instructed a student to make the intercom call for security;
  3. Stepped between the students, facing the assailant, with a chair for protection;
  4. Disabled the assailant if he attempted to further assault me or anyone else.
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1-would be fine
2-Not every school has an intercom, phones or walkies to do that.
3-LAWSUIT, You will be at the HOUSE for a LONG time, fired and probably arrested by that kid's parent for trying to use a weapon ona kid
4-Depending on the district-you could be fine. Now there is CPI training that some schools have that will teach you how to restrain and so with a kid tha twill protect you from lawsuits.

NOw here is some more bad news for that teacher-

He is seen on ANOTHER video letting kids fight. What is WORST you see one boy STRIPPING down to his shorts to fight another boy.

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http://www.wfaa.com/video?id=121612564&sec=552897

News 8 has obtained new video showing another fight inside Seagoville High School. It's the second video News 8 has been given that shows students fighting inside teacher Lindale Muse's geometry classroom.

"This is definitely neglectful," said DISD trustee Nancy Bingham. "As a teacher, you have responsibility to have order in the classroom. It did not appear he had it."

Sources said the new video was shot three weeks ago. It shows students preparing for a fight.

One of the teens is shirtless and even has time to remove his shorts. The teacher stands in the background, appearing to watch.

After facing off, as if in a boxing match, the students then begin exchanging punches.

Muse is now on extended indefinite leave, as the school district investigates.

When reached by phone Tuesday, Muse, 54, denied allowing fights in his classroom, but added he's not allowed to break up fights.

"That's my school policy — DISD policy," he said. "Teachers are not responsible for breaking up fights."

DISD does not have a clear policy on whether teachers should step in between fights. Teachers are told to first send someone for help.
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skyvolt2000 said:
...3-LAWSUIT, You will be at the HOUSE for a LONG time, fired and probably arrested by that kid's parent for trying to use a weapon ona kid...
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I understand your position but the concern is unmerited. The chair (or table) is not a weapon but a shield for yourself and the student(s) you are protecting. You are in a defensive posture. You announce to the assailant and for all witnesses to hear, "I am standing with this chair (table) to protect myself and this student from your attack. I will defend myself and the other students if you continue to attack." A law enforcement officer would tell the perp the same sort of thing. If the kid attacks and you subdue him without malice, you are covered.
 
dacontinent said:
I understand your position but the concern is unmerited. The chair (or table) is not a weapon but a shield for yourself and the student(s) you are protecting. You are in a defensive posture. You announce to the assailant and for all witnesses to hear, "I am standing with this chair (table) to protect myself and this student from your attack. I will defend myself and the other students if you continue to attack." A law enforcement officer would tell the perp the same sort of thing. If the kid attacks and you subdue him without malice, you are covered.
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And u will be in jail, jobless, and with some money.
 



Ya'll worried about a lawsuit...with video? Give me a break.

First of all this wasn't a "fight"...this was a situation in which one student was just going at another student. As a teacher in the situation you have to at the very least say something...this azz just stood there and watched/enjoyed watching what was going down.

I mean what if that was your kid getting punched in a classroom...on tape...and the teacher just stood there. I guarantee you wouldn't be worried about a lawsuit then.

On another note, however, did that kid just say "He was physically trying to hurt me...I could see it in his eyes???"...I guess he couldn't see the anger in his fist either.

EDIT: Just saw the second video...yeah, I dunno about that teacher, man...he has absolutely no control. I don't remember schools being this crazy when I was in elementary, middle, and high school.
 
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Man let these lil thugs hurt each other if they wanna. That is all they know. Somebody should have tazed they azz.
 
That teacher came to my friend's private school where she teaches, she sent me a text saying the school saw the news story and fired dude :read:
 
Teachers in that school district must have really gotten bad raps for intervening in the past. And this teacher's class has just become the "arena". I'ma get you when we get to geometry. In all my years of school, I ain't never seen a fight during class with the teacher right there. If the district has crazy policy such that teachers don't know if they should or shouldn't intervene, then something is seriously wrong. I think the district would rather some kid get beat up than possibly pay a teacher from some assault leave claim.
 
This is a joke and I hope the teacher hit them with a law suit. The teacher followed school policy and not they want to give the teacher grief.

I laugh at the white folks in Dallas when the video aired....policy says don't get involved...whites say '...he's big and black...' he could have broke the fight up. It would have been okay for the teacher to break the rules.
 
Teacher was wrong. Point blank. How the hell do you just stand there and let an innocent kid get assulted??? Yall people are something else. Now two "thugs" hashing it out and being plain ignorant.....yeah, I'd step back. But this fool should have stopped it before it even got that far.


Tell me this, what would you want a teacher to do if your kid was being attacked and did nothing to provoke the situation.....
 
Sad situation. Sad. Sad. Sad. Can't blame it on urban people and their neanderthal-like nature lol because suburban types do this type of foolishness as well. I think the instructor followed protocol but I don't see where a request to the calvary was sent. :confused: A teacher's job is to teach, not referee or breakup a fight. lol That's campus security's/principal's jobs. However, it is an instructor's job to control their classroom. :read: W/out the use of physical force.
 
PVSAX99 said:
What would you have done in that situation?
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I would've asked ONE of the students to leave and escorted him out the door. The teacher's in charge of safety in that classroom. Just standing there and doing nothing was laughable. One can't get a lawsuit for escorting a student out the door.

Plus fights usually start with words, then it escalates into something more. Teacher may need to learn de-escalation techniques on how to prevent fights before they start.
If the student being punched was a female or smaller kid, would you all have the patience to stand there and watch a dude pound on a female?
 
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