SWAC Rules Part 2.

[SAME OLD G]

The point is that the Swac is too busy worrying about when the bands play that they still can't get their own officials to call the game. Swac officials are a joke in football, basketball and even baseball.

Did it ever dawn on you that maybe...just maybe the coaches told their ADs or even the commissioner that they needed to do something about the bands?

And even if that's not the case, we have talked about this subject many times before in the past. Don't act as if this is anything new.

 

[docmump]

If you haven't realized, SWAC "football", as a product, is a laughing stock. It just sounds like the "football faithful" are bitter because the bands are LITERALLY saving our precious product that is SWAC Football. Subjecting our bands to these rules ain't gonna improve the quality of our "product" at all....

MESSAGE...

This is what needs to be addressed not what the bands are doing.

What's going to happen is these bands will stop attending these "classics" and let the SWAC and the Football teams pack these stadiums.

 

[SAME OLD G]

What's going to happen is these bands will stop attending these "classics" and let the SWAC and the Football teams pack these stadiums.

That will not happen either. That's just want you want to happen.

 

[docmump]

No Sir. What I want is for the band directors and the SWAC officers to get together to make these rules. Instead of letting people who are not affliated with the bands make the rules.

 

[PsiSnake]

Oh well. I still don't think the bands are that bad and I am a big critic. I sincerely hope bands start staying at home if folks think they are such a distraction. I have never seen SU band disrespect Pete and the football team. I also see Mr. J closely watching the action. Maybe some of these renegade band directors trying to make a name for themselves have caused some of this. Might as be like the PWCs and only have the home band show up for the most part. I know I wouldn't want to play in this era. Glad I marched in the 80s.

....I feel'ya frat. I also admit that bands can do a better job at quieting before the ball is snapped.

I wish all the bands would come together and agree to not play at all during the games. If they have to take it further; not perform at halftime too. Yes that's a bit extreme, but in order to make a strong stance against this, it would take drastic measures to get folks attention; because apparently, the SWAC office, the SWAC coaches, or whoever agreed to this new rule does not know or understand the role our bands play in gameday experience from a fan POV. They are underestimating us as if the bands are insignificant.

Ey.....you take away the bands, you would start losing money....straight up.

"Snake"

 

[SAME OLD G]

I wish all the bands would come together and agree to not play at all during the games.

Then you risk not having a band at all. No student wants to join a band that does not perform.

Besides, the presidents will not allow it.

 

[SAME OLD G]

No Sir. What I want is for the band directors and the SWAC officers to get together to make these rules. Instead of letting people who are not affliated with the bands make the rules.

How do you know that they haven't met already?

 

[PsiSnake]

Then you risk not having a band at all. No student wants to join a band that does not perform.

Besides, the presidents will not allow it.

....that may be true.

But then the president would lose students/future students from the school and also fans/alumni from football games. Thats money dawg! You hit somebody in the pockets, they'll feel the wrath.

"Snake"

 

[DAHILL]

Then you risk not having a band at all. No student wants to join a band that does not perform.

Besides, the presidents will not allow it.

no then a change would be made.... My mom told me when she was at Tn State, the administration wouldnt give the band any money for uniforms.... the band refused to go to games until something was done about.... after 3 or 4 weeks they had money for new uniforms. A band is much more powerful than what you think. Maybe because you arent from the South, you dont really understand or didnt grow up in a "band" culture.

 

[Fiyah]

How do you know that they haven't met already?

They haven't, this is more dictatorship from the swac office.......

 

[SAME OLD G]

Maybe because you arent from the South, you dont really understand or didnt grow up in a "band" culture.

That's not entirely true, but that is another subject.

 

[docmump]

Let's not get to name calling in this thread. Let's just post our opinion about the SWAC office and the ruling. Thanks.

Then you risk not having a band at all. No student wants to join a band that does not perform.

Besides, the presidents will not allow it.

That's my point SOG, this is an issue for the schools and it's officials, Band and atheletics, not the SWAC office. The SWAC office should make recommendations to the teams, the teams take them to the Presidents, and the presidents says 'Yes or No'.

Once again, I do not believe the SWAC office has any authority over an University Band. That power only resides at the school level and maybe with the President and his/her staff.

 

[philharmonic]

OK, so what does that have to do with the bands? One thing has nothing to do with the other.

Exactly! So why penalize one for the other! Every band doesn't provide the negative elements you describe at the state Fair Classic! So because of the actions of two idiots then the rest have to suffer???


Bullsh*t!


That's the mamby-pamby attitude that has us in the situation we're in now!

 

[SAME OLD G]

Once again, I do not believe the SWAC office has any authority over an University Band. That power only resides at the school level and maybe with the President and his/her staff.

Let me try to make this clear to some of you because I sense that some of you think that you are entitled to do whatever you want to do when at these games.

First and foremost, these games are sanctioned by the NCAA. The SWAC (being a member of the NCAA) is required to play according to the NCAA handbook. Secondly, the SWAC has the right to implement any additional rules for its conference games that it deems necessary. Therefore, if the bands are going to play at SWAC games, they have to abide by SWAC rules...therefore the SWAC has the right to set these rules just like the bands have the right to decide whether or not they will attend any particular game.

It really is that simple. Like it or not.

 

[SAME OLD G]

Exactly! So why penalize one for the other! Every band doesn't provide the negative elements you describe at the state Fair Classic! So because of the actions of two idiots then the rest have to suffer???

I have been to the classic in Little Rock as well. Both bands played when they shouldn't have.

 

[Fiyah]

Let me try to make this clear to some of you because I sense that some of you think that you are entitled to do whatever you want to do when at these games.

First and foremost, these games are sanctioned by the NCAA. The SWAC (being a member of the NCAA) is required to play according to the NCAA handbook. Secondly, the SWAC has the right to implement any additional rules for its conference games that it deems necessary. Therefore, if the bands are going to play at SWAC games, they have to abide by SWAC rules...therefore the SWAC has the right to set these rules just like the bands have the right to decide whether or not they will attend any particular game.

It really is that simple. Like it or not.

Actually it's not that simple.........

Let the bands from the SFC (just using this as a example) be known that they are not going to perform at that game. I betcha their wouldn't be close to 30K (half of what usually pay to come to that game) be there.

The Swac Football Experience is a total experience which includes the bands with all of their pomp and circumstance.

 

[JayRob]

Actually it's not that simple.........

Let the bands from the SFC (just using this as a example) be known that they are not going to perform at that game. I betcha their wouldn't be close to 30K (half of what usually pay to come to that game) be there.

The Swac Football Experience is a total experience which includes the bands with all of their pomp and circumstance.

Wow....this coming from Fiyah?! You are exactly right though. Teams with losing records who don't bring a band have no chance of bringing fans.
Hell, even winning teams will have a significant dropoff in attendance if there's no band.

 

[SAME OLD G]

Actually it's not that simple.........

Let the bands from the SFC (just using this as a example) be known that they are not going to perform at that game. I betcha their wouldn't be close to 30K (half of what usually pay to come to that game) be there.

The Swac Football Experience is a total experience which includes the bands with all of their pomp and circumstance.

Bad example. Both of the bands are actually paid to appear (contractually). The bands are not going to turn that money down.

 

[philharmonic]

I have been to the classic in Little Rock as well. Both bands played when they shouldn't have.

And? Your point is?

This ruling is moreso based off of what? The common thread of what happened at the State Fair Classic and what you saw in little Rock is................? Not all directors blatenly break rules! And like someone said how can the really make these rules stick? Remember the bottom line is $$$!!! Suspend a and for a classic game and see what happens! No respectable director is going to allow another band to come and steal a show from them due to a fricking rule! Are you kidding? Step up the play on the field and quit making all of those bogus and phantom calls then make some rules for everyone to follow!


This is MY view!

 

[Fiyah]

Bad example. Both of the bands are actually paid to appear (contractually). The bands are not going to turn that money down.

No it's actually a great example.

Why do you think they are paid to perform?

Because they bring in paying customers to this game. Here's a example why they are paid to perform. The year PV didn't have football( I think it was 1990 or 91) and Grambling ended up playing Elizabeth City State. Tickets was non existance until they signed PV's band to play the halftime. Even though ECS was bringing thier band. After that was announce and ads were shown saying this, tickets took off. Without PV's & GSU's band there to play, no one was coming to this game.

Do you honestly think people were coming to see the football game?

 

[SAME OLD G]

Not all directors blatenly break rules!

I agree...and then there are those that simply don't know or don't even care about the rules

And like someone said how can the really make these rules stick?

The same way a band will stop playing after one of the refs either gives the band a warning or even penalize a football team because of some dumb isht the band does. We have seen this happen many times before. Those refs make it stick then huh? :lol:

Remember the bottom line is $$$!!!

Exactly...football money that the band probably doesn't get to see (more times than not).

No respectable director is going to allow another band to come and steal a show from them due to a fricking rule!

Unfortunately, that is the problem. The band directors think the football game is about them, not realizing that the bands have to respect the rules of the football game just like everyone else. Do the bands have to be there...no? But if any band makes the decision to appear at a football game then you have to respect the rules and conduct yourselves accordingly.

Are you kidding? Step up the play on the field and quit making all of those bogus and phantom calls then make some rules for everyone to follow!

You should follow your own advice. The bands need to step up and play according to the rules set by the SWAC and NCAA and stop making excuses for a rule that is the result of your own negligence. The refs didn't create these rules.

 

[SAME OLD G]

No it's actually a great example.

Why do you think they are paid to perform?

Because they bring in paying customers to this game. Here's a example why they are paid to perform. The year PV didn't have football( I think it was 1990 or 91) and Grambling ended up playing Elizabeth City State. Tickets was non existance until they signed PV's band to play the halftime. Even though ECS was bringing thier band. After that was announce and ads were shown saying this, tickets took off. Without PV's & GSU's band there to play, no one was coming to this game.

Again...what does this have to do with the bands respecting the rules of the football game? Hell, using your example/logic if I am a paying customer and I see on the ticket that the seats are general admission I should be able to sit anywhere I want to right? Now does this mean I can sit right in the middle of the trumpet section? I mean after all the seats are general admission right? But we both know that as a paying customer there are some restrictions on that general admission ticket. I will not be able to sit with the band.

That same thing applies to the band. Just because you are there, it doesn't give you the right to do whatever the hell you want.

Do you honestly think people were coming to see the football game?

Unfortunately, this match up has been such a historical joke due to PV's inability to field a competitive football team, it has evolve to become nothing more than a circus. Hopefully this will change now that PV is becoming more competitive on the field. It will not happen over night, but one can only hope.

 

[SAME OLD G]

My Question is this: Does the SWAC office have this type of authority? If so, how, when the band if a function of the school not the athletic Department.

Does the SWAC give the Band any funds or scholarships?

I would love to see them enforce these suspension rules.

From the 2008 NCAA Football Rules and Interpretations Handbook
http://www.ncaapublications.com/Uploads/PDF/Football_Rulesadc982b5-03fb-4e27-828c-c2d26b95e6c1.pdf

SECTION 1. General Provisions

Persons Subject to the Rules

ARTICLE 6. All players, substitutes, replaced players, coaches, trainers, cheerleaders in uniform, band members in uniform, mascots in uniform, commercial mascots, public-address announcers, audio and video system operators, and other persons affiliated with the teams or institutions are subject to the rules and shall be governed by the decisions of the officials. Affiliated persons are those authorized within the team area.

SECTION 2. Noncontact Fouls

Unsportsmanlike Acts

ARTICLE 1. There shall be no unsportsmanlike conduct or any act that interferes with orderly game administration on the part of players, substitutes, coaches, authorized attendants or any other persons subject to the rules, before the game, during the game or between periods.

b. Other prohibited acts include:
1. During the game, coaches, substitutes and authorized attendants in the team area shall not be on the field of play or outside the 25-yard lines without permission from the referee unless legally entering or leaving the field (Exceptions: Rules 1-2-4-g and 3-3-8-c).
2. Team area personnel who are outside the team area and who have involvement or impact on live-ball play are subject to penalty under
Rule 9-1-5-a.
3. No disqualified person shall enter the field of play or end zones.
4. No person or mascot subject to the rules, except players, officials and eligible substitutes, shall be on the field of play or end zones during any period without permission from the referee. If a player is injured, attendants may come inbounds to attend him, but they must obtain recognition from an official.
5. No substitute(s) may enter the field of play or end zones for purposes other than replacing a player(s) or to fill a player vacancy(ies). This includes demonstrations after any play (A.R. 9-2-1-I).
6. Persons subject to the rules, including bands, shall not create any noise that prohibits a team from hearing its signals (Rule 1-1-6).

PENALTY?Dead-ball foul. 15 yards [S7 and S27] from the succeeding spot. Flagrant offenders, if players or substitutes, shall be disqualified [S47].

 

[MikeBigg]

Hell, if the band folk don't like it... just start a Band League. That's right, all the folks who go to see the band can say the hell with the game, we're going to the "Band Stadium" or designated place and see the Band show. With all these undefeated bands, it should be a good turnout. Don't get upset if I choose not to check out the score of the band games.

:smh::smh::smh:

 

[SAME OLD G]

Hell, if the band folk don't like it... just start a Band League. That's right, all the folks who go to see the band can say the hell with the game, we're going to the "Band Stadium" or designated place and see the Band show. With all these undefeated bands, it should be a good turnout. Don't get upset if I choose not to check out the score of the band games.

:smh::smh::smh:

:lol: