Southern protesting decision to play UAPB


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Southern protesting decision to play UAPB

By JOSEPH SCHIEFELBEIN
[email protected]
Advocate sportswriter

A day of discussions with the Southwestern Athletic Conference office ended Monday with a decision that doesn?t sit well with the Southern University baseball team.

The SWAC ruled Southern must play Arkansas-Pine Bluff at least once and possibly twice beginning at 1 p.m. today on the campus of Jackson State University in Jackson, Miss., to make up games canceled by rain on March 11 in Pine Bluff, Ark. Jackson State is a neutral site.

The games need to be played, according to the conference office, to alleviate a logjam for third place in the Western Division. That spot provides the final berth in the SWAC Tournament beginning Thursday in Shreveport.

Grambling (22-24, 14-18 Western Division) has as many divisional wins as UAPB (25-26, 14-16). UAPB, however, is currently third in the standings because of percentage points.

"These two games have a bearing (on the tournament)," SWAC interim commissioner James Frank said.

Frank said if UAPB won the first game, a second game would not be necessary.

Southern plans to protest the decision.

"I?m stunned," Southern coach Roger Cador said.

Cador was still scrambling to find bus transportation after the SWAC made its decision late Monday night.

Cador said he had no idea who would be his starting pitcher today, as he spent the weekend gearing his pitching staff for the tournament. He said many of his regulars may not play either.

Southern (39-6, 27-3 Eastern Division) begins SWAC Tournament play against Alabama State (23-25, 17-15), the No. 3 seed in the Eastern Division, at noon Thursday at Centenary Park in Shreveport.

According to Cador, Southern maintained that conference bylaws said rained-out games had to be played within a week and that the teams had played a enough divisional games to determine seeding.

Southern?s four-game set at UAPB was to begin March 9, but because of rain the teams didn?t play until March 10. Southern stayed in town, but inclement weather on the 11th didn?t allow the games to be played.

When the teams played again April 13-14 in Baton Rouge, they only played the scheduled four-game set instead of attempting six games in three days.

Frank said he could not have predicted the two rained-out games would be so important. Even so, he did not order the teams to play earlier than today.

None of the Eastern Division teams was required to finish all 32 games. Only No. 1 seed Alcorn State (24-20, 18-14) and No. 3 seed Alabama State (23-25, 17-15) have played all their divisional games.

No. 2 seed Jackson State (20-26, 15-13) is four games shy, and fourth-place Alabama A&M (14-25, 13-16) is three games shy.

"If he?s going to make us play to determine the fate of Grambling, he?s got to make the guys in the East play," Cador said.

If A&M were to win its three games and Jackson State were to lose all four, Alabama State could move up to the No. 2 seed, A&M to the No. 3 spot and Jackson State out of the tournament.

"You don?t have a similar situation there," Frank said. "This (Southern and UAPB) is the only situation like this."

Of the Eastern scenarios, Frank said, "(Tuesday) is the last day. You have to quit sometime."

Two years ago, Alcorn State didn?t play enough games to play. Though Alcorn was possibly the best team in the Eastern Division, 18-11 overall and 13-5 in the division, the Braves did not go. Instead, UAPB (18-33, 13-17 in 2000) went in Alcorn?s place.
 
As my boy Jafus would say....

Interesting!!!

Notification on Monday night to play these make up games? Where was Frank last week or immediately after these games were missed due to rainouts?
 



Is not baseball one of minor sport that Surge said nobody cared about? It appears someone at GSU do care. I wish someone at SU had the balls to just forfeit the game to UAPB today. If you going make one team play make-up game(s), all teams should makeup games not played. GSU you want Daddy to come to your rescue. Don't worry we will take care UAPB for you.

July can't get here fast enough -- good riddance James Frank.
 
If possible, SU needs to forfeit these games... SU has nothing to gain from this matchup. The conference could have decided a long time ago to make up these games. You obviously can't start your best pitchers with the tournament starting two days later

To make matters worse, SU would have to play a second game if they won the first one.

If the games are so important, maybe the tournament needs to start a week later.
 
Hell if I was Coach Cador I would forfeit too. Southern has nothing to gain by doing this.

Grambling has no business being in the tounament this year...we suck this year in baseball.

I am not one who believes in conspiracy theories, but this is one of those times that a person could say, "the SWAC is just doing what it can to make sure GSU gets in the tournament since it is just 60 miles down the road from Shreveport".

Hmmmmmmm
 
Good point SOG. I never thought of it that way. I don't mind making up the games, but you would think they could have done a better job of scheduling a makeup. If I was the commish I would have had GSU and UAPB play a winner take all game if they are tied. Don't penalize SU for it. Or anybody else for that matter. Let those team in question play it out. That will be more fair to the schools than SU playing UAPB. We know what that outcome is going to be. SMH@ SWAC thinking.
 
If I was the commish I would have had GSU and UAPB play a winner take all game if they are tied.
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That sounds like the best move to me.



If possible, SU needs to forfeit these games
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Don't agree with that move, but i understand the suggestion. SU forfeiting puts a smudge on their overall record and leads to poor PR come Regional time. I rather see SU play the guys with no time in at all and rest their big guns for the tournament. SU can also use the option of pitching by committee. Their staff is deep enough to give players and inning or two of work, while keeping them fresh for Thursday (or whenever the tourney starts).
 
You're right... JR poses the best scenario but this is the SWAC. Good logic is usually an afterthought in their decisions.

My point is SU should not have to deal with the last minute travel wear & tear this close to tournament time.

Does SU lose on purpose to avoid a second game? Do you win and play another meaningless game against UAPB. Maybe a forfeit looks better than a loss to UAPB.
 
My point is SU should not have to deal with the last minute travel wear & tear this close to tournament time.
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I agree whole heartedly. This was a poor move by the SWAC.


Does SU lose on purpose to avoid a second game? Do you win and play another meaningless game against UAPB. Maybe a forfeit looks better than a loss to UAPB.
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I don't think a game is meaningless. I know SU has at least 15 pitchers and 9 non-everyday starters. They would not see this as a meaningless game. Tune up for them would be a good thing in my opinion.

I don't like the idea of forfeiting, but it does make since for SU in this scenario if you're worried about missed class time and wear n tear by travel. I'm sure they will have intense practices until the travel date, so playing is not the issue in my opinion. SU can play spoiler to UAPB or GSU. Who would SU rather face if the #3 seed actually had to play them?
 
SU coach was right. That wasn't right, because you have a similar situation in the East Division.
 
SWAC leadership is the problem.

Let's get the facts in order:
1. Until this week the SWAC did not even know Grambling's won-loss record. Their website had omitted 2 early season games with Texas Southern. I had e-mailed them with this info, but they didn't correct it until yesterday.
2. The 2 games between Southern & UAPB could have been played in Baton Rouge when UAPB was there 2 weeks ago.
3. While, SU shoulded be penalized by the conferences ineptness, neither should Grambling. They played all their games and they beat UAPB 5 out of 8. That gave them the tie-breaker.
4. The situation in the EAST is this: Jackson State missed 4 games & Alabama A&M missed 3. All were against Mississippi Valley. No way they could play 7 games before the tournament.

So, let's not cry over what transpired & enjoy the tournament and root for your favorite team. The six teams that will be there are all deserving of their places. Blame the league for the confusion.
 
According to the article in today's Advocate, the SWAC has an 80% rule, i.e., winning percentages will determine final rankings as long as teams play 80% of their conference games.

Since all teams played 80% of their games, yesterday's games were not needed and Ark-PB should have been in.

I think Kenn's reasoning is the best explaination for this decision.

Regards.
 



Originally posted by Dr. Mac
According to the article in today's Advocate, the SWAC has an 80% rule, i.e., winning percentages will determine final rankings as long as teams play 80% of their conference games.

Since all teams played 80% of their games, yesterday's games were not needed and Ark-PB should have been in.
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Exactly! Remember the mess from 2 years ago with the SWAC East schools. I think it was Alcorn who could not go to the tournament because they were told by the conference that they had not played 80% of their schedule. And they had finished the season among the top 3. Alabama A&M went instead.

With all of that said...<b>Go Grambling!</b> :D

*snicker*
 
A solution

Starting next year, let the 4 & 5 teams from each division have a 1 game play-in to get into the tournament. Then send 8 teams to the show. That would give everybody a chance to make the tournament. It would also make the tournament more exciting.
 
Well, here goes.....GEAUX JAGS!!!!!!!!

SU sweeps Ark.-Pine Bluff, bumps GSU into tourney

Advocate staff report
JACKSON, Miss. -- Under odd circumstances arose an equally odd outcome. The Southern University baseball team actually helped out its rival Grambling on Tuesday.
Southern, stringing together a collection of pitchers, including some who had rarely played all season, easily topped Arkansas-Pine Bluff 17-7 and 6-1 at Jackson State University.

The games were made necessary when interim Southwestern Athletic Conference commissioner James Frank late Monday night said Southern and UAPB must play two games rained out in early March to finalize the Western Division standings for this week's conference tournament.

The two losses keep UAPB (25-28, 14-18) out of the SWAC Tournament, which begins Thursday at Centenary Park in Shreveport. Grambling (22-24, 14-18) moves into the third and final Western Division playoff spot and will face Alcorn State (24-20) at 6 p.m. Thursday.

Southern (41-6, 29-3 Western Division), the No. 1 seed in the Western Division and the defending SWAC champion, opens the SWAC Tournament at noon Thursday against Alabama State (23-25).

"I'm happy (with the wins), but still pretty upset," Southern coach Roger Cador said. "This is not normal. It's very abnormal (to be required to make up games the week of the tournament)."

Though the standings of teams Nos. 2-4 in the Eastern Division could be affected if No. 2 seed Jackson State played four rained-out games and No. 4 Alabama A&M made up three, the SWAC did not require those teams to make up their rained-out games this week.

As a result of the addition of Tuesday's games, if Southern were to advance to Sunday's championship round, the Jaguars will have played at least eight games in eight days and in three states. Southern arrived in town after 11 p.m. Sunday night after a five-plus hours trek from Prairie View, spent six hours in a bus Tuesday and gets back on the road for a five-hour journey to Shreveport this morning.

With the SWAC not making its unprecedented decision until late Monday, many of Southern's players got phone calls after 10 p.m. telling them to report for a 9 a.m. bus ride. What's more, a majority of players had to get in touch with their professors Tuesday morning to reschedule final exams -- which had already been moved ahead in order to accommodate today's departure for the tournament.

No one from the SWAC office, through Sunday, had contacted Cador for the possibility that Tuesday's games might be necessary.

All Monday, Southern argued UAPB and itself had already played 93.8 percent of their divisional games, more than the 80 percent required.

Because rainouts are a fact of life in baseball, most conferences, like the Southeastern Conference, determine tournament seeding based on winning percentages. That's how the SWAC Eastern Division was decided this season. Had the games not been played Tuesday, UAPB would have qualified for the tournament based on divisional winning percentage.

Last season, two Eastern Division teams, plus Grambling (16-14 in the Western Division a year ago), did not play a full 32 divisional games.

In 2000, one of the frontrunners in the Eastern Division, Alcorn State, was barred from the tournament because it did not play enough conference games (with 14 games rained out).

Southern, on a nine-game winning streak (with seven wins with at least 12 runs), has swept all eight games from UAPB each of the last two seasons.

Instead of straining the pitching staff needed for the tournament, Southern's top starters and relievers stayed in Baton Rouge. Nine players shared 14 innings Tuesday.

"We really spread it around, tried to give some people some action," Cador said.

FIRST GAME

m?SOUTHERN 17, UAPB 7: Fred Lewis went 4-for-4, with a home run, extending his hitting streak to seven straight at-bats as Southern romped.

Adrian Lee made his third appearance and second start, Jerome Anderson (1-1) his eighth appearance, Darrin Senegal his first appearance, Geber Urbina his seventh appearance and Dave Foreman his ninth appearance.

Also hitting home runs for Southern were Kevin Vital and Theo Dumas. Vital finished with four RBIs while Lewis, Antoin Gray and Robert Primus had 2 RBIs apiece.

SECOND GAME

m?SOUTHERN 6, UAPB 1: Antoin Gray, snubbed from a position nod on the All-Western Division team, smacked his 19th home run of the season and his eighth in the last eight games, to start Southern in the first inning.

Southern used four pitchers, with Chris Berry making his second appearance of the season, in holding an opponent to one run for the first time since April 14 (also UAPB). The Jaguars' six runs were there lowest total since a 13-2 loss at LSU on April 16.

m?NEXT GAME: Southern likely will start senior right-hander Eric Thomas (6-0, 2.96 ERA, 33 strikeouts) against Alabama State in the SWAC Tournament opener. The teams did not play this season.
 
Antoin Gray, snubbed from a position nod on the All-Western Division team, smacked his 19th home run of the season and his eighth in the last eight games, to start Southern in the first inning.
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What player(s) and what stats beat out a kid with 19 HRs?
 
Originally posted by b8sball17


What player(s) and what stats beat out a kid with 19 HRs?
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All I can say is the SWAC must not have wanted SU to sweep the infield positions. Our 1B, 2B and SS were all-SWAC and Gray should have been the All SWAC 3B.

The SWAC split the 3B award with the kids from GSU & TSU. No direspect, but neither are even close to Gray's numbers. Actually the only hitter in the SWAC better than Gray is Rickie Weeks.

Gray did receive the newcomer of the year award..... True SWAC logic for you!!
 
UAPB SNATCHED FROM POSTSEASON

By Nate Olson/OF THE COMMERCIAL STAFF

A ruling made by the Southwestern Athletic Conference office Tuesday eliminated the Arkansas-Pine Bluff baseball team from the SWAC Tournament it had apparently qualified for, UAPB baseball coach Elbert Bennett said Thursday.

"It shows we have poor leadership in the Southwestern Athletic Conference office," Bennett said. "They are doing a tremendous disservice to the athletes involved in baseball in the SWAC.

"The young men and women, who compete in athletics deserve better than this. This is embarrassing."

Monday, UAPB was preparing for Thursday's tournament in Shreveport, La., in which the No. 3 seed Golden Lions were set to play No. 1 seed Alcorn State.

The top three seeds from the East and the West compete in the post-season tournament.

However, the conference was informed by Grambling State Coach Wilbert Ellis, who is also the chairman of the SWAC baseball committee, that UAPB and Southern had two games that were rained out in early March.

In 2000 then-commissioner Rudy Washington ruled that all SWAC teams were required to play 80 percent of their scheduled conference games.

UAPB played 94 percent of its games. Southern had met its requirement as well.

However, the SWAC ruled late Monday night that UAPB was to play Southern in Jackson, Miss., on Tuesday at 1 p.m. in a doubleheader, in which the dominant Southern squad swept UAPB.

"That put us at a huge disadvantage," Bennett said. "They made us play the toughest team in the league at a neutral site. That means that we played them twice at home, four times on the road and two times at a neutral site.

"We shouldn't have had to play the games, but if we did they should have been played in Pine Bluff. They waited too long, and decided they had to play it at a neutral site to make it easier on both teams. We found out so late, that we had to leave four of our pitchers, and seven players in all, because we couldn't get everybody together on short notice and some players had exams."

SWAC interim commissioner James Frank faxed UAPB athletic director H.O. Clemmons a memorandum informing UAPB it had two more games left.

"Because the two rained out games between Southern University and the University of Arkansas at Pine Bluff would have determined whether Arkansas or Grambling qualifies for the post season baseball tournament, I am hereby directing that the two teams play at 1:00 p.m., Tuesday, April, 30 at the Jackson State University baseball field in Jackson, Ms," SWAC interim commissioner James Frank wrote in a memorandum issued to Southern and UAPB that was sent at 4:37 p.m. Monday.

"The decision is based upon the fact that neither Southern or Arkansas-Pine Bluff has completed their 32-game divisional schedule and because the games have a direct bearing on the final spot in the SWAC baseball tournament. I recognize that it places an additional burden, at the last minute on the schools, but it is in the consistency to our bylaws and to Grambling State University, this decision has been made."

However, the bylaws don't match the decision, at least the original bylaws don't.

The conference faxed a set of bylaws to both schools that states each team in the conference has to play just 24 of its divisional games to be eligible for the tournament. However, the 24 was marked out with a pen and the handwritten 32 replaced it.

The SWAC made the decision after it ruled that No. 2 seed Jackson State, who did not make up four of its games, was declared eligible for the tournament.

"That was unfair," Bennett said. "Why would Jackson State and Mississippi Valley State, who missed four games against each other, not have to make those up. If Jackson State had lost those games they may not have made the tournament. It doesn't make any sense why we have to make up games, and they don't."

After the two losses Tuesday, UAPB finished tied with Grambling for the final spot with identical 14-18 conference records.

The SWAC ruled since Grambling held a 5-3 advantage over UAPB in eight games this season, Grambling would play in the tournament and UAPB was forced to take the long bus ride back to Pine Bluff.

"They (the conference) never did officially notify us," Bennett said. "I never was given a fax that detailed the tie-breaker rules. I never saw anything that said the team with the better head-to-head record advanced to the tournament.

"That is usually a football rule. In baseball you usually settle a tie with a one-game playoff."

Bennett and Southern Coach Roger Cador drafted a letter that was sent back to Frank stating that both coaches opposed the decision to play. Cador opposed the game because he didn't want to play two games two days before his team was set to begin play in the tournament.

However, both schools' athletic directors elected to play the games after discussing the matter with Frank.

"These two games have a bearing (on the tournament)," Frank told the Baton Rouge Advocate Tuesday.

Attempts to reach a spokesperson from the SWAC Thursday were unsuccessful.

"It was probably politics that caused us to have to play," Cador said in a phone interview Thursday afternoon following his team's 20-2 trouncing of Alabama State in the first round of the SWAC Tourney. "It was an opinion rendered, an opinion doesn't carry diddly squat in a court of law.

"What happened won't happen anywhere else in America. A decision rendered that late is abnormal to say the least. Other teams in the other division had a similar situation and didn't have to play. If they (Jackson State) had lost those games it could have affected the season. It's highly abnormal. It just doesn't make sense. "In the eyes of rational thinking people it leaves black eyes for the conference."

Because of the timing of the news, Bennett had no time to consult legal counsel. Bennett had to scramble to get his players ready for a 6 a.m. departure to Jackson.

"I talked with university attorneys, and they said since we played the games we didn't have a chance," Bennett said. "They said if we hadn't played we might have been able to file an injunction. We were notified too late.

"I think like a coach, I thought we could win one of two and make the tournament, but we shouldn't have played those two games."

Bennett said his players are still in shock after having their season ended before they even got to Shreveport, and for his players, and for UAPB, Bennett has vowed not to go quietly.

"The players are devastated," Bennett. "I'm not through with it. I'm going to write all of the school presidents. I'm going to put all of the events that took place into a chronological order and show the discrepancies that took place. We were treated differently. It is grossly unfair."

The SWAC has an advertisement on its Web site for a new commissioner. Bennett said he hopes the conference will hire someone that will prevent further debacles like the one he has been involved in.

"We have to look at some of the activities that take place in Birmingham," he said. "We have a commissioner that doesn't understand the guidelines that were made by another commissioner.

"You can't make up rules as you go. I am fairly, fairly disappointed and embarrassed. No individual, The President of the United States or the commissioner of the SWAC, no one is above the law. I don't care if he is the commissioner. He is wrong. I think it is time for members of the conference to rise to the level of other conferences and, be more professional. We have poor leadership and poor organization. It should be an embarrassment for every school affiliated."
 
I agree with UAPB's coach. Not only does it show the poor leadership of the conference, it shows that GSU Coach Ellis would cheat to get his team in. He of all people should have known the 80% rule of the conference since he is head of the committee. He also knew that UAPB was not going to beat SU and advance.
 
Originally posted by Machiavelli
FIRST OF ALL BASEBALL TEAMS SHOULD BE REQUIRED TO PLAY ALL OF THE GAMES ON THE SCHEDULE.
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No they shouldn't. You can't control the weather, and the costs are too high to just reschedule that often. The 80% rule is the best way to do it. This whole thing is horrible on the SWAC.
 
A solution

Why not have a week between the end of the regular season & the beginning of the tournament so any games that have an affect on the standings can be made up. Otherwise, send everyone to the tournament so no one will feel slighted.
 
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