Controversial Thought...


PVSAX99

PVSAX99

Well-Known Member
I believe that illegal immigrants really AREN'T taking up all the U.S. jobs. Instead, they are starting up their own companies and are thriving (for the most part).

So can we actually blame the illegal immigrants for the condition of our economy?

What's more, if they can take advantage, regardless of the economic situation, why WON'T we? :shame:

Care to discuss?
 
I been reading case studies on employment factors for the past two weeks for grad school and illegal immigrants are not taking up all of the jobs.. that is mere lou dobbs, glenn beck hype...
 



I remember hearing a couple of years ago that there are a LOT of tax incentives for legal immigrants that start businesses that we are not entitled too (b/c we're not immigrants) so that's why it's "easier" for them to start up with less.

Here in Chicago-area (may be nationwide), I was told the reason why so many immigrants own gas-stations/corner stores is b/c they get a tax credit for so many years, then it expires. Well...from what I was told...when it's set to expire they put the business in another family member's name and get a new tax credit.

Don't know how true that is...but I can believe it, especially with the fact that City Departments that should probably check/follow-up on things like that...don't. So it's easy to get away with it.
 
You are correct SS. I have been doing lawn care on the side for 11 years. I know a bunch of latino's who tell me they get contracts based on a special contract clause from companies. Also these guys will take for instance a 2 acre yard that takes about 2-3 hours to do for less money than folks wioth common sense will take. They will charge $90, when in reality they should charge $160. They live two to three famlies in a 3 bed room apartment splitting it 100 bucks a piece. They can afford to do that. We on the the other hand live in one family homes paying the full cost alone. Folks need to be honest, we aren't slaves any more. Why should I take a job that cost me hours and time for 50% less and still have to pay the full cost of living, and they are splitting it 1/3 of the cost to live. It's not that we don't want those jobs, we just can't survive off of them. Let's be honest, you aren't putting 3 black families in one house like we did back in the days. It was once a time when we would have, but those days are gone. 6 grown folks and 10 kids in a 3 bed room ain't gone happen for Americans in 2009. I had sista asked me to cut her 3 acre yard for $90. I told her get a crack head or kiss my left azz cheek. The truth is that it's educated black folks who want to screw you and pay you less. White folks will pay for quality service. The best thing i ever did was get into the Asian community. Once they know you, you will have all of them. Us on the other hand wanna pay you half today, then half next week. How you gone wanna split 60 bucks in half. :shame:
 
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CEE DOG said:
You are correct SS. I have been doing lawn care on the side for 11 years. I know a bunch of latino's who tell me they get contracts based on a special contract clause from companies. Also these guys will take for instance a 2 acre yard that takes about 2-3 hours to do for less money than folks wioth common sense will take. They will charge $90, when in reality they should charge $160. They live two to three famlies in a 3 bed room apartment splitting it 100 bucks a piece. They can afford to do that. We on the the other hand live in one family homes paying the full cost alone. Folks need to be honest, we aren't slaves any more. Why should I take a job that cost me hours and time for 50% less and still have to pay the full cost of living, and they are splitting it 1/3 of the cost to live. It's not that we don't want those jobs, we just can't survive off of them. Let's be honest, you aren't putting 3 black families in one house like we did back in the days. It was once a time when we would have, but those days are gone. 6 grown folks and 10 kids in a 3 bed room ain't gone happen for Americans in 2009. I had sista asked me to cut her 3 acre yard for $90. I told her get a crack head or kiss my left azz cheek. The truth is that it's educated black folks who want to screw you and pay you less. White folks will pay for quality service. The best thing i ever did was get into the Asian community. Once they know you, you will have all of them. Us on the other hand wanna pay you half today, then half next week. How you gone wanna split 60 bucks in half. :shame:
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Kinda made me think of the time when Paul Mooney said, "They came here willingly to work for a quarter. We came here against our will to work for FREE..."
 
PVSAX99 said:
Kinda made me think of the time when Paul Mooney said, "They came here willingly to work for a quarter. We came here against our will to work for FREE..."
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It is really true. Man they have under cut us so bad in the business it is beyond sad. See making a small amount of money is great for them, because they live in bucks like Sam's vs Walmart. They will hit a community and under bid everyone by several dollars. I mean honestly you can't be mad at your costumers when they can save a dollar. That's the American way.After you factor in gas, equipment cost and time you have nothing really, when they send their money back home it makes a big difference. Three hundred bucks ain't nothing in the USA, but in Mexico it's a lot. I really don't get into my business side with folks, I just had to let yall know this myth is a lie. Most brotha's are leaving the business because they can't really beat them out. They will have 5 to 8 guys working for 3 bucks a piece, when the 40 or 50 you make is going to still put you under. I just keep it real. I still gotta pay taxes, they don't.
 
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CEE DOG said:
The truth is that it's educated black folks who want to screw you and pay you less. White folks will pay for quality service. The best thing i ever did was get into the Asian community. Once they know you, you will have all of them. Us on the other hand wanna pay you half today, then half next week. How you gone wanna split 60 bucks in half. :shame:
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Man you ain't lying. My brother has his own lawn care business on the side, and he tells me the same thing. He's constantly having to run after some of his black customers to get the money that they owe him for cutting their yard. He says he never has to do that with his white customers. Hell, he says some of them leave the check on the kitchen table, tells him where the spare key is, and what the alarm code is so the can go into the house, get the check, fix himself a drink, etc. Some of them offered full use of their pool if it gets too hot and he needs to take a dip, LOL!!
 
On a lighter note...I'm sorry...but:

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:lol:
 
It's called capitalism and that's the beauty of it. There is a market for lawn care, and the market is very competitive which saves money for those who demand the service. I personally have a black guy cutting my yard and he always tell me to give him whatever I can give him.......that's smart business. Why? I(customer) hold the power without negotiating, and I'm mentally pressured to give a generous tip if he does a great job. The genius in his approach is that he's not obligated to service the lawn again if the amount given was too low, but if the amount given was reasonable; then he keeps the customer and moves on. He and I share the same business principles in reference to the amount of volume(customers) being the focus and driving force instead of the amount of $$$$. The more customers you have, the more money you'll make, which will lead to more people being hired. He also cuts yards for a few Titans players as well....

The great thing I like about this thread is that a few of you own a business on the side, and you see how it directly effects you. Having said that, we cut our own throat by not reporting illegal immigrants.
 
I feel you Cee. I've been in Texas for 10 years and I don't think I've ever seen a lawn care business that wasn't hispanic-owned outside of 2 of my fellow Jags who shut theirs down 5 years ago. Even then, they only cut businesses.
 
ROYAL BLUE said:
It's called capitalism and that's the beauty of it. There is a market for lawn care, and the market is very competitive which saves money for those who demand the service. I personally have a black guy cutting my yard and he always tell me to give him whatever I can give him.......that's smart business. Why? I(customer) hold the power without negotiating, and I'm mentally pressured to give a generous tip if he does a great job. The genius in his approach is that he's not obligated to service the lawn again if the amount given was too low, but if the amount given was reasonable; then he keeps the customer and moves on. He and I share the same business principles in reference to the amount of volume(customers) being the focus and driving force instead of the amount of $$$$. The more customers you have, the more money you'll make, which will lead to more people being hired. He also cuts yards for a few Titans players as well....

The great thing I like about this thread is that a few of you own a business on the side, and you see how it directly effects you. Having said that, we cut our own throat by not reporting illegal immigrants.
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I agree with this! To me, it seems as if people fail to make these reports because they know that they can thrive off the REALLY cheap labor. But while they are getting the money little by little, our economy is falling by the way-side.

So...in essence, by us exploiting the situation by taking advantage of their illegal status, we really are cutting our own throats.

Honestly, I think that if they (the government) were actually more concerned with illegal immigration, they wouldn't have begun to start offering ALL of our services in English and Spanish, or allowing businesses to solicite potential emplyees that are bilingual. Not to mention the business grants that are being given to immigrants to start their own businesses.

But I digress...this isn't about immigrants. This is about ILLEGAL immigrants who are thriving on our dime. The sad thing is that they aren't as concerned as we think they are.
 
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But how can you report somebody as an illegal alien when you don't KNOW they are illegal? They'd pretty much have to tell you.
 
jag4life said:
But how can you report somebody as an illegal alien when you don't KNOW they are illegal? They'd pretty much have to tell you.
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I don't think that an illegal alien could legally prove their citizenship to the United States.

You are right, you'd have to ask them for that information...
 
jsupop33 said:
We should bring back the guest worker program
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Hmmm...I kinda like that idea!!!! But there are holes within this program that I am skeptical of.

First and foremost, this program seems to grant amnesty toward illegal aliens, even if that amnesty is limited -They can work here...but they got three years to get their green card, or they're getting deported back to whence they came (I guess that's the ironic beauty behind it).

Also, it is unclear if undocumented workers would even sign up for the program. I'd imagine that they wouldn't want to risk being deported, on the chance that they don't get their green card.
 



ROYAL BLUE said:
The great thing I like about this thread is that a few of you own a business on the side, and you see how it directly effects you. Having said that, we cut our own throat by not reporting illegal immigrants.
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No company is going to report illegals if they are not causing real trouble in thier area (unless you live in Irving or Farmer's Branch).

Because most are looking at it like this-hire those illegals or deal with US. They rather deal with them than us.

Also I don't think those illegals are starting up businesses, it's more the legal ones are starting them up and "hiring" illegals for jobs. Unlike us they support each other and build up thier areas off of scraps from jobs.

they wouldn't have begun to start offering ALL of our services in English and Spanish, or allowing businesses to solicite potential emplyees that are bilingual.
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This is what happens when English isn't the official language in the USA. Thye have no reason to speak it (many can speak it but when given the option...) when someone is willing to speak to it in their native tongue.

Yet of you go outside the USA, that is not an option. You either learn that language or wing it. We cater to them because many are a source of cheap labor and less stress at times.

This does effect us in the schools. I hear folk crying about illegals taking all our resources in school. Yet who is actually taking advantage of all the resources? THEM (legal or not).

So who is really wasting tax dollars? The 17 year old black 9th grader or the 18 year old illegal 12th grader with 15 offers to college? Attending the same schools and resources available?
 
ROYAL BLUE said:
It's called capitalism and that's the beauty of it. There is a market for lawn care, and the market is very competitive which saves money for those who demand the service. I personally have a black guy cutting my yard and he always tell me to give him whatever I can give him.......that's smart business. Why? I(customer) hold the power without negotiating, and I'm mentally pressured to give a generous tip if he does a great job. The genius in his approach is that he's not obligated to service the lawn again if the amount given was too low, but if the amount given was reasonable; then he keeps the customer and moves on. He and I share the same business principles in reference to the amount of volume(customers) being the focus and driving force instead of the amount of $$$$. The more customers you have, the more money you'll make, which will lead to more people being hired. He also cuts yards for a few Titans players as well....

The great thing I like about this thread is that a few of you own a business on the side, and you see how it directly effects you. Having said that, we cut our own throat by not reporting illegal immigrants.
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Blue, this is the best damn post you ever had. :lol: But like someone else pointed out, how do you know they are illegal immigrants.
 
PVSAX99 said:
I agree with this! To me, it seems as if people fail to make these reports because they know that they can thrive off the REALLY cheap labor. But while they are getting the money little by little, our economy is falling by the way-side.

So...in essence, by us exploiting the situation by taking advantage of their illegal status, we really are cutting our own throats.

Honestly, I think that if they (the government) were actually more concerned with illegal immigration, they wouldn't have begun to start offering ALL of our services in English and Spanish, or allowing businesses to solicite potential emplyees that are bilingual. Not to mention the business grants that are being given to immigrants to start their own businesses.

But I digress...this isn't about immigrants. This is about ILLEGAL immigrants who are thriving on our dime. The sad thing is that they aren't as concerned as we think they are.
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Please don't believe all that Illegal Immigrants is ruining our economy bull crap. You cats are beginning to sound like Rush Limbuagh. The Illegal Immigrants didn't cause U.S. companies to start out sourcing work and jobs to other countries. That started to happen way before Illegal Immigrants were even a discussion. We went from the #1 manufacturing country to nothing. Most companies have move stuff like Call Centers and help desk phone support work to India. You know how many jobs that have been lost because of that? That's what has hurt America. Not those little peanut jobs you all are talking about. If it was my choice I would open the Mexican border and let all those mofos come over. Nobody is complaining about the Canadian border being wide open.
 
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Styles said:
Please don't believe all that Illegal Immigrants is ruining our economy bull crap. You cats are beginning to sound like Rush Limbuagh. The Illegal Immigrants didn't cause U.S. companies to start out sourcing work and jobs to other countries. That started to happen way before Illegal Immigrants was even a discussion. We went from the #1 manufacturing country to nothing. Most companies have move stuff like Call Centers and help desk phone support work to India. You know how many jobs that have been lost because of that? That's what has hurt America. Not those little peanut jobs you all are talking about. If it was my choice I would open the Mexican border and let all those mofos come over. Nobody is complaining about the Canadian border being wide open.
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Disclaimer:

But in my VERY first post (the first post in this thread), I said that I believe that illegal aliens AREN'T taking up our jobs, and I went on to question the beliefs that they may be responsible for the condition of our economy. I DON'T believe they are the problem with our economy. I guess I kinda worded what you pointed out in red inaccurately.

At that time...I was trying to bring focus back to the actual point of this thread (about illegal immigrants, and not naturalized citizens). That quote you pointed out in red WASN'T a reflection of my belief. I was just merely trying to keep the topic of this dicussion in focus. My bad...
 
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PVSAX99 said:
Disclaimer:

But in my VERY first post (the first post in this thread), I said that I believe that illegal aliens AREN'T taking up our jobs, and I went on to question the beliefs that they may be responsible for the condition of our economy. I DON'T believe they are the problem with our economy. I guess I kinda worded what you pointed out in red inaccurately.

At that time...I was trying to bring focus back to the actual point of this thread (about illegal immigrants, and not naturalized citizens). That quote you pointed out in red WASN'T a reflection of my belief. I was just merely trying to keep the topic of this dicussion in focus. My bad...
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No problem. I totally agree with your initial post.
 
Styles said:
Please don't believe all that Illegal Immigrants is ruining our economy bull crap. You cats are beginning to sound like Rush Limbuagh. The Illegal Immigrants didn't cause U.S. companies to start out sourcing work and jobs to other countries. That started to happen way before Illegal Immigrants were even a discussion. We went from the #1 manufacturing country to nothing. Most companies have move stuff like Call Centers and help desk phone support work to India. You know how many jobs that have been lost because of that? That's what has hurt America.
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Well know folks want someone to blame as they are the ones that people see everyday.

Of course those companies will tell you if they don't outsource prices will be higher for things. Which I don't agree with most of that.
As I have learned being in Dallas, you lose/spend more money covering up crimes, highing kinfolks, employee turnover, wasted training on folks that BOLT in six months, firing criminals, hiring based on race and COURT FEES:shame:. That P-Card scandal cost taxpayers $100,000 million dollars and who knows what that City Hall court case will cause us.

Yet folks want to say illegals are ruining us. Yet all that involved were legal US citizens.
 
jsupop33 said:
I been reading case studies on employment factors for the past two weeks for grad school and illegal immigrants are not taking up all of the jobs.. that is mere lou dobbs, glenn beck hype...
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I see, thanx for the input. To be honest with you I see that a lot of Mexicans in our area just more room for growth in terms of more profit I think as far as the economy as of now I think that the gov't has placed a limit on who they hire and it is not because of Mexican or whomever (meaning it was on a "first some first serve" basis):).
 
jag4life said:
But how can you report somebody as an illegal alien when you don't KNOW they are illegal? They'd pretty much have to tell you.
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If they can't speak English, then their azz is illegal. It's impossible for Mexicans to make it in the US if they can't speak English.....or have a Mexican buddy helping them to get by.

The best way to report illegal immigrants is by making citizens aware of "intelligently" identifying/reporting illegal immigrants. Law Enforcement should encourage citizens to report "ALL" suspected illegal immigrants regardless if they're certain or not........remember the Harvard professor? Law Enforcement can not search/question illegals "WITHOUT" having probable cause. If the citizens would do their part and make a report, then the officers will have "probable cause" to search, question, and bust illegal immigrants. Doing it this way will keep law enforcement from facing discrimination lawsuits.
 
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