Can a black head coach have continous success in major college football?


jsupop33

jsupop33

Loyalty & Respect
I have pondered this question for a while. I ultimately think black head coaches are at a disadvantage when it comes to recruiting kids still. Convincing parents to let you be their child's father figure for the next 4-5 years.

Has a black coach ever won a D-1A/FBS title?
 
I think it's possible. Dennis Green and Tyrone Willingham put in work at Stanford and David Shaw is carrying on the tradition now. 2 hot guys on the scene now that are making noise are Kevin Sumlin (Houston) and Mike London (Virginia)
 



I think ultimately black parents can/will make or break the success of black coaches at major colleges. Black parents have to/need to demand that their kids play for black coaches rather than going to play for Les Miles or Nick Saban, people who ultimately don't understand them or where they come from. There is no way Randy Shannon should not have been allowed to build a powerhouse at Miami. Kids should have been lining up to play for that brother. He was turning that program around. We as black folk have to support black coaches, until then, there won't be a lot of success at a major level.
 
What about recruiting white o-lineman or white players in general? David Shaw is currently winning with Harbough's guys so lets give him 4-5 years.
 
michstjag said:
I think ultimately black parents can/will make or break the success of black coaches at major colleges. Black parents have to/need to demand that their kids play for black coaches rather than going to play for Les Miles or Nick Saban, people who ultimately don't understand them or where they come from. There is no way Randy Shannon should not have been allowed to build a powerhouse at Miami. Kids should have been lining up to play for that brother. He was turning that program around. We as black folk have to support black coaches, until then, there won't be a lot of success at a major level.
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The reason those black kids go to the Sabans and others could be that they don't trust that black coach.

How many of those players are coming form single mother homes? Where black man after black man had done momma wrong?

How many parents with NFL dreams see the path EASIER under a white coach versus a black one? OUtside of the SWAC & MEAC-how many other black coaches have had guy in the NFL?

How many parents fear that the black coach will demand MORE (or LESS) than the white one?

How much stuff does Saban and others let their players get away with that a Randy Shannon or other black coach might not allow? Remember that black coach is on a shorter leash than a lot of white coaches-good or bad.

How many of those white players have had black coaches at any time during thier public/private school career? Or seen a successful program with a black coach in charge?

Also do the ALUM want a black coach? Hard to get all that new stuff and money if the ALUM don't want you. Even if you win.
 
Not many white head coaches have had continued success over the past decade. Les Miles (even though they were ready to fire him last year), Saban, Mack Brown, Pete Carroll, Chris Peterson, Gary Patterson and Bob Stoops are about it. Throw in Urban Meyer with Tebow.

That's 8 out of 115+ FBS schools.
 
Man yall know how to try and read into stuff. Black kids don't go on to play for black coaches because, right now, there are no truly established black coaches on the scene. We get on this board and talk about supporting black coaches and stuff, but we fail to realize or really understand the thought process of this generation of youth. These kids in this generation are all about flash and how does it benefit me. They go to the Nicks and Les for one or two reasons: 1) These guys win titles and are traditionally in a position to win again; 2) these guys, because of the success of their programs, put kids in the leagues. Right now black coaches are trying to establish themselves in this market.....the only Black coach at a MARQUEE program is Shaw of Stanford. Seriously, what top athlete with thoughts and dreams of NFL stardom want to go to Kansas, New Mexico, Kentucky, Louisville, etc?

We as adults worry about the political and societal ramifications of their actions whereas they (like most young adults) are only worried about the here and now and how it benefits them.
 
wbishop3 said:
Man yall know how to try and read into stuff. Black kids don't go on to play for black coaches because, right now, there are no truly established black coaches on the scene. We get on this board and talk about supporting black coaches and stuff, but we fail to realize or really understand the thought process of this generation of youth. These kids in this generation are all about flash and how does it benefit me. They go to the Nicks and Les for one or two reasons: 1) These guys win titles and are traditionally in a position to win again; 2) these guys, because of the success of their programs, put kids in the leagues. Right now black coaches are trying to establish themselves in this market.....the only Black coach at a MARQUEE program is Shaw of Stanford. Seriously, what top athlete with thoughts and dreams of NFL stardom want to go to Kansas, New Mexico, Kentucky, Louisville, etc?

We as adults worry about the political and societal ramifications of their actions whereas they (like most young adults) are only worried about the here and now and how it benefits them.
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And this, my friends, is the essence.
 
If you don't think players at Kansas, Louisville and Kentucky have NFL dreams, then you're incredibly naive.

All of those schools will have players at the NFL combine and I can think of one off the top of my head that has a chance to be a fairly high draft pick - Kentucky's Danny
Trevathan.

Athletes choose schools for several reasons. Playing time, proximity to home, academics and many other reasons. I imagine that the color of a coach's skin is far down on the list of priorities if it's on the list at all.


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wbishop3 said:
Man yall know how to try and read into stuff. Black kids don't go on to play for black coaches because, right now, there are no truly established black coaches on the scene. We get on this board and talk about supporting black coaches and stuff, but we fail to realize or really understand the thought process of this generation of youth. These kids in this generation are all about flash and how does it benefit me. They go to the Nicks and Les for one or two reasons: 1) These guys win titles and are traditionally in a position to win again; 2) these guys, because of the success of their programs, put kids in the leagues. Right now black coaches are trying to establish themselves in this market.....the only Black coach at a MARQUEE program is Shaw of Stanford. Seriously, what top athlete with thoughts and dreams of NFL stardom want to go to Kansas, New Mexico, Kentucky, Louisville, etc?

We as adults worry about the political and societal ramifications of their actions whereas they (like most young adults) are only worried about the here and now and how it benefits them.
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Great post. :tup:
 
has a black coach ever been give the chance to get the keys of a "storied" program? Outside of Blake and Simmons at OU and OK State

FB - LSU, UT, Alabama
BB- Duke, UNC, Kentucky (Tubby Smith)
Baseball - never will happen
 
the band fan said:
has a black coach ever been give the chance to get the keys of a "storied" program? Outside of Blake and Simmons at OU and OK State

FB - LSU, UT, Alabama
BB- Duke, UNC, Kentucky (Tubby Smith)
Baseball - never will happen
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In football, there was Tyrone Willingham at Notre Dame and Karl Dorrell at UCLA.

In basketball, Larry Farmer had a stint at UCLA. Mike Davis coached at Indiana for seven years following the Bob Knight era.
 
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This what I know about success of winning programs. For example LSU hired Chavis, Brick Haley and Cooper. These guys are top recruiters, well spoken, polished, educated and if they come to the home a highly recruited high school athlete they have a 99% chance of getting who they want. If you look at the successful prorams they have atleast two of these guys on staff. These guys average salaries are between 250,000 to 300,000 dollars a year. When we came into the SWAC, certain SWAC schools recruited better than others and if we wanted to compete, (not with major schools) we had to match up with our competition, therefore, we had to up our recruiting efforts. tbf, made a great point. Not every team is winning in the SEC or other conferences, because they have issues, just as teams in our conference who are not winning. Only a few schools make millions of dollars and can pay coaches what Saban is getting. Blacks coaches will not have this type of success because they are expected to do miracles with less.
 
Notre Dame, UCLA, etc. ain't those "dog" programs where you can go into the hood and get that 6-5, nasty d-lineman with a checkered past...you see why they're average now as trying to recruit a middle class black kid is real hard..

Knight's rep killed Indiana when it was all said and done...are they even ranked now?
 
the band fan said:
Notre Dame, UCLA, etc. ain't those "dog" programs where you can go into the hood and get that 6-5, nasty d-lineman with a checkered past...you see why they're average now as trying to recruit a middle class black kid is real hard..

Knight's rep killed Indiana when it was all said and done...are they even ranked now?
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Lou Holtz used to get those types of players you're talking about to come to ND to the chagrin of many alums back in the day.

Randy Moss actually signed a letter of intent to play for the Irish before he eventually ended up at Marshall.
 
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the band fan said:
Notre Dame, UCLA, etc. ain't those "dog" programs where you can go into the hood and get that 6-5, nasty d-lineman with a checkered past...you see why they're average now as trying to recruit a middle class black kid is real hard..

Knight's rep killed Indiana when it was all said and done...are they even ranked now?
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Mike Davis actually did a good job at Indiana, those folks just weren't satisfied with him. Kelvin Sampson was the one that destroyed the program with all of those recruiting violations at Oklahoma and Indiana.
 
kendrick said:
In football, there was Tyrone Willingham at Notre Dame and Karl Dorrell at UCLA.

In basketball, Larry Farmer had a stint at UCLA. Mike Davis coached at Indiana for seven years following the Bob Knight era.
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Nolan Richardson at Arkansas?

Johnny Dawkins at Stanford?

Mike Jarvis at St.Johns

John Thompson III at Georgetown?

Tommy Amacker at Michigan- didn't get a fair shake since he took over when all of that probation mess from the Fab 4 took effect.

Anthony Grant was going to be the head coach at Florida until Billy Donovan chose to come back. I also think had the SEC not been so stuck in the past, Charlie Strong would have been the next coach at UF.
 
they've given us basketball programs as blacks dominate the sport...but we don't get good football jobs...

BUt will we ever get UNC or Duke...the media's darlings..
 
number1 said:
Nolan Richardson at Arkansas?

Johnny Dawkins at Stanford?

Mike Jarvis at St.Johns

John Thompson III at Georgetown?

Tommy Amacker at Michigan- didn't get a fair shake since he took over when all of that probation mess from the Fab 4 took effect.

Anthony Grant was going to be the head coach at Florida until Billy Donovan chose to come back. I also think had the SEC not been so stuck in the past, Charlie Strong would have been the next coach at UF.
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I wouldn't call Arkansas, Stanford or Michigan "storied" basketball programs, though. But I get your point nonetheless.
 
Well yall can say what you want to make whitey look like he is not holding us back, but white people don't want a black coach to be successful. Dumb black folks only want to play for white males because it makes them respect their massa! Run Toby! Jump Kunta!
 
SUJagFan said:
Wow.

Arkansas and Michigan are not storied programs? What does it take to be a storied program?
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When I think college basketball, Arkansas and Michigan don't come to mind. Maybe football. Not basketball even though the schools have won national championships in the sport. They are not on the same level as Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Kansas, UCLA etc., as far as storied goes.
 
CEE DOG said:
Well yall can say what you want to make whitey look like he is not holding us back, but white people don't want a black coach to be successful. Dumb black folks only want to play for white males because it makes them respect their massa! Run Toby! Jump Kunta!
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You really think all skin is kin, huh? These Black coaches aren't doing any of these Black kids any favors. If it's my child that's being recruited, I'm looking at his best interests from an educational standpoint first and then what the school can offer him athletically. If a team coached by a Black coach isn't making the best presentation, well that's the Black coach's loss.
 
When these Black coaches get jobs at major D-I football programs they lose b/c they are on a shorter leash, i.e., these guys, I believe are constantly trying to run "clean" programs in fear of getting sanctioned by the NCAA. That fear is pretty much nonexistent for white coaches. Look at how Kiffin has USC winning again and his team will be a preseason top 10 next season while on probation. I don't think a Black coach could do that b/c the NCAA would throw the book at him if he was found guilty of some violating NCAA rules.
 
Money always buys the best and money will keep you on top. But to win you must dominate the game and officials
 
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